This episode is a live & unedited recording of A Powerful Conversation Series: The Rise & Empowerment of Women in Iran. This recording took place on Saturday October 8th, 2022 in response to and support of the protests happening in Iran being led by brave young women asking for freedom for Women, Life and Liberty. Our amazing panelists include: Dr. Marjan Koosha Johnson a physician and entrepreneur Dr. Marjon Vatanchi, board certified dermatologist Parisa Frost, Marriage, Family & Clicinic Art Therapist & cultural researcher Pegah Ghamary, real estate advisor Dani Stevens, model, mother & motivator Sara Seyed, Human Rights Lawyer, Actor & Activist Enjoy this episode and please share it so that the efforts of the women and girls in Iran is being heard by as many people as possible. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
“Most importantly, we want the women and girls of Iran to know we see you, we hear you, we are inspired by you, & you are not alone. We are standing beside you.”
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This episode is a live & unedited recording of A Powerful Conversation Series: The Rise & Empowerment of Women in Iran. This recording took place on Saturday October 8th, 2022 in response to and support of the protests happening in Iran being led by brave young women asking for freedom for Women, Life and Liberty.
Our amazing panelists include:
Dr. Marjan Koosha Johnson a physician and entrepreneur
Dr. Marjon Vatanchi, board certified dermatologist
Parisa Frost, Marriage, Family & Clicinic Art Therapist & cultural researcher
Pegah Ghamary, real estate advisor
Dani Stevens, model, mother & motivator
Sara Seyed, Human Rights Lawyer, Actor & Activist
Enjoy this episode and please share it so that the efforts of the women and girls in Iran is being heard by as many people as possible.
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Follow along using the Transcript
Chapters:
00:00 Introduction to the Powerful Ladies Podcast
01:06 Panel Introduction and Purpose
01:41 Marjan Kha Johnson's Perspective
02:48 Dr. Marjan Vici's Insights
03:34 Patti Saro's Reflections
04:23 Sarah Sayed's Contributions
05:30 Danny's Passionate Support
06:06 Pega Gamar's Empathy and Connection
07:28 Current Situation in Iran
08:24 Historical Context and Personal Stories
11:34 Social Media's Role in the Movement
20:59 Global Support and Future Hopes
40:43 Frustrations and Hopes for Change
47:42 Personal Reflections and Family Ties
48:07 Global Support and Hope
48:56 Political Realities and Human Rights
50:52 Strategies for Change
53:00 Powerful Ladies and Human Rights
55:09 Continuous Advocacy and Support
56:00 Final Thoughts and Actions
57:54 Global Perspective and Solidarity
01:41 Historical Context and Current Struggles
I am Kara Duffy, and this is The Powerful Ladies Podcast. This episode is a live and unedited recording of a powerful conversation series, the Rise in Empowerment of Women in Iran. This recording took place on Saturday, October 8th, 2022, in response to and support of the protests happening in Iran being led by brave young women.
Asking for freedom for Women Life and Liberty. Our amazing panelists include Dr. Marjan Cusa Johnson, a physician and entrepreneur, Dr. Marjan Achi, a board certified dermatologist, Parisa Frost, a marriage, family, and clinical art therapist and cultural researcher, Pega Gamar, a real estate advisor, Danny Stevens, model mother and motivator.
And Sarah Ed, human rights lawyer, actor and activist. Enjoy this episode and please do share it so that the efforts of the women and girls in Iran is being heard by as many people as possible.
Welcome to the Powerful Ladies conversation about the rise in empowerment of women in Iran. I am very honored today to have amazing women who are much more knowledgeable about Iran and its history and its culture and what's going on than I am. I'm so honored that they said yes. I'm quickly going to screen share so you can get a preview of what who are panelists are and we'll be talking about today.
This is who we have today. We are very lucky to have these women here. They're taking time out. There are protests literally happening right now around the world. And they took their time to come and talk to you guys. I'm gonna open it up first with Marjon Kha Johnson, who is the instigator for this conversation.
Marjan, would you please introduce yourself, tell everyone where you are in the world and why this matters so much to you. Hi everybody. I'm Marjan. Yes, I'm Marjan Kha Johnson. I am in in Laguna, California. And I. Felt very compelled to have something like this and connect with Kara because everything that's going on in Iran, it's not the first time this has happened.
This is like one of many revolutions that have happened, but this is the first time females have been at the forefront of things. So I just felt okay, as a female living outside Iran, it's my duty and responsibility to spread awareness about it and and do really whatever it is that I possibly can, which in this context, not being there has been telling the world, telling everyone I know and getting other people involved.
So I'm really excited to be here and chatting with everyone. Thank you so much. And from there we'll jump to our second beautiful marj of the day. Same questions. Where are you? How do you say your whole name and why does this matter to you? Okay. Thank you for having me. I am Dr. Marjan Vici. I'm in Orange County, California.
And this matters because we are witnessing people that are frustrated that they do not have basic human rights on a personal level. And I live outside of Iran. I have been hearing stories ever since I was a child of what rights women do not have, which is basic rights as if they don't even have the right to child custody, should they have a divorce.
But that is just, the tip of the iceberg. The more I find out, the more disturbing it is. What these individuals are asking for is so basic that I cannot help but be involved. And I think the more that people learn about it, they will feel the same way. Perfect. Thank you. Hi, my name is Patti Saro.
I'm based out of Los Angeles, California. And really just to echo what the first Mar two mjs have said. There's such an absence of fundamental human rights and this has gone on for so long, and it wasn't always the case. We've heard stories from our mothers and grandmothers of the rights and liberties that they enjoyed prior to this oppressive regime, and we've essentially gone into this tyrannical time machine and hopped back tens, hundreds of years, and for what?
And so to really amplify these voices and to amplify these stories of these women so that they're not dying in vain, that's my main reason for being here, to really pay homage to that bravery and doing whatever I can to amplify their screams. Thank you, Sarah.
Hi everybody. My name is Sarah Sayed. I'm currently based in la it is an absolute pleasure to be amongst all of you. Thank you to your audience for tuning in. I think that this is probably one of the most important parts of being part of this movement. And also empo empowering people inside, being informed constantly listening to those who have something to say.
Let's say this. I would like to say, I would like to just not only remember, but also give praise to my brothers and sisters back home. They've not only been inspiring, but they've been transformed, like their movement has transformed many people who it has touched in ways that have inspired them.
Compelled them to do something in, in an extraordinary way. And I give, I, we all are here just trying to be of service to them and to their movement. And hopefully this will stay alive and we'll keep kicking and we'll keep supporting them as best as we can. Thank you, Danny.
Good morning from Australia. I was so passionate to join this morning. I think I woke up at 3:00 AM but then my body just naturally woke up at about 4:30 AM So it is my honor and privilege to be with all of you beautiful women. And Sarah said, I have a platform and I want to be able to be the voice of Iran.
And I don't think we were born in, like today to watch our brothers and sisters and daughters and granddaughters suffer the atrocities that we are seeing today. So I want this to end today. So I stand with the women and people of Iran. I. Love it. Thank you, Pega.
Hi there. I'm here in La Jolla, San Diego, California. And just like Danny and others have said this is such an important time to come together. And remember our interdependence just around the world we're what, seven, 8 billion sisters and brothers. And if one of us is hurting, all of us are hurting.
And even though I wasn't, I was born here, born and raised here in the us just because I am not in the same circumstances as the people who are going through so much in Iran, doesn't mean that. I can't empathize that I can't, that I haven't had those same feelings. And I think that I bring this up because, not because it's about me, but because I think that whoever's on here, whoever's listening can also relate because we've all felt devalued.
I don't care if you're a woman, a man, if you identify with what you identify with, if everyone has experienced being devalued and or at least knows someone that they care about who's been devalued. And so from this place of being human, we can support one another and we must support one another.
Thank you guys. So I'm gonna open up with the first question, which is, just getting really clear with everyone about what is actually happening on the ground. You know that we've seen there be a rise in teenagers protesting in school, people protesting on the streets, men stepping up to support women in ways they never have before.
And then the internet has been cut out, which I've been told is so that we don't see the atrocities of what's happening. The last count I also heard was that there were something around 130 confirmed deaths from the protests that are happening, and more and more women keep being found that have been go, gone missing, unfortunately dead.
That's what I know. That is what I know from News Clips that I've been able to grab in snippets. So who knows more and who wants to share about the realities of what's on the street right now? Go ahead, Marja, jump in. Yeah, this is a jump in. So just as you guys feel compelled, unmute. So I think I mentioned this previously, but there was an, a similar revolution green movement that happened.
I think it was 2009, 2010, something like that. I could be off, but similarly, there was an uprising. So one of the biggest fundamental issues like Marjan pointed out in Iran is that women don't have basic rights. And that's the right to ride a bicycle, and that's the right to have custody of their children after divorce, leave the country if they're married, et cetera, if their husband doesn't allow for that.
Now, the other problem that's really, I think, fueled a lot of this fire, and it also did back when it initially had happened, the first revolution was that. There's so many people living in poverty in Iran. And when I say that it's like this singer songwriter Shevin had written a song about it, about how like, parents can't provide their kids with things that we really take for granted here.
And I think, that's a big propellant for a lot of people to speak up because I think they're just, they've got nothing to lose anymore. And that's why we're seeing generation Z girls, 16-year-old girls out in the streets throwing off their hijab and burning it or stepping on pictures of the supreme leaders from the past.
And what I really wanna make clear though is that I have no religiou affiliation. But this is not in any way, shape or form a rise against Islam. I think that a lot of people collapse the two and they're afraid to speak out about it because of that reason. Because they're like, oh, I don't wanna seem Islamophobic.
And it's absolutely not that. It's a woman's right to choose and not, and in here a woman's right to choose is a completely different conversation there. A woman's right to choose. She dresses, if she can ride a bike, how she composes herself if she would like a divorce, without having to get the permission of 15 other people to do and then for families to be able to afford bread, I was in Iran before I started medical school, and I saw people that like, they couldn't afford to go have chicken for dinner. It's just it's atrocious. And so I think that coupled with the fact that they're so oppressed, women are so oppressed.
Even the men are oppressed in a lot of ways. Be gay. That's not allowed. You will be killed if you are found to be gay. That oppression, I think has caused this upheaval of I've just got nothing to lose anymore, so I'm gonna throw myself out there in this movement hoping that some change will come as a result of it.
To speak farther on that you are asking what is people don't know or what is not being shown and it's very dark. There's a reason they're cutting the internet. And the worst part is, we have these videos coming out from the major cities. Tehran Mashhad, but, and where people have cell phones, but some of the poorest regions where nobody really has a cell phone is where we're seeing just vile behavior of the local government.
About eight days ago in Balu, Tristan, which is very poor region where they don't even have the proper medical care that they need the local guards there just fired into the protestors. Children, adults o over a hundred people were injured, but over 80 died, including children. And they call, they're now calling it Bloody Friday, but it's very dark.
For instance in just preparing for this podcast, I learned that there is a government law, of course there, this is fake Islam, but they're saying that in Islamic law that prison guards can rape people who are being kept in the prisons. Men and women, even though being gay is illegal, that if you pray before the rape takes place, then it's legal and lawful.
So I can't even imagine if somebody, now speaking on what Marin said, regarding the poverty level, over 50% of Iranians live be below the poverty line, which is where you're seeing this frustration. This is how they live every day. So imagine you steal bread to feed your family, and now you're in prison and you get to be raped, day by day from guards.
None of this makes sense. I'm surprised this information is something that's not public, but it is easy to not think about or talk about. This is why we need the support of un, we need allies all over the world because, and we've heard this before, that if there are not basic human rights everywhere, it's a threat to human rights.
You know where we are as well.
And there. Oh, Sarah, please. Hi. Hi. Oh hi everyone. Just wonderful conversation. Just piggybacking off the ladies, but also on a much, much lighter note. I want to say that it is very important to know that women have always been part of movements that have ever occurred historically in Iran.
What we're seeing now that is different and incredible in a sense is that it's all inclusive. Women used to, women have been beside, student movements have been beside union. Strikes have been historically synergistically involved in every other type of movement. What's important now is that it's spearheaded by women.
So we need to always understand that there is this narrative that. We tend to overanalyze in West in that women want autonomy, they want the freedom of self-expression, which they absolutely do. But what is different also that we need to understand is that it comes from not to separate but basically delineate between the two.
Is that here in West we're more about body autonomy, self-expression. You can say partly in a, from a privileged perspective, whilst in Iran, women are not just oppressed socially, they're oppressed politically, economically civil wise. And if there is a hierarchy of rights, be it the always obviously economical status and civil being the triggers underneath it.
So there is this undercurrent of women not being able to hold positions in office positions of power, be judges, be involved in the judiciary in a sense that is, effective be in offices and also safety. Because there is this notion that, there's this constant rhetoric being reiterated by the patriarchy that exists, that women wouldn't be safe doing certain types of jobs.
But what's very important, and I want everyone who's not been to Iran for a long time, I actually have not myself, I've been away for 10 years. I partly because of my activism. But I was born and I grew up there. I'm, I was literally, I used to wear the hijab. I used to wear the scarves at school. I used to actually wear veil.
I used to go to a school where we had to wear chador. The long black veil. What's very important is to know that this generation and the generation before, they're very smart. They're intellectual, they're very connected to the west. I would say very vibrant and very much, energized to connect to the world.
Internet has exacerbated that in, in so many good ways. But when you think of a population that is very young very in touch with the world, when we talk about fashion, you go to Tehran and is unbelievable. It's like Paris. We are talking about a six 65% of higher educated people. People who graduate are girls.
They're not just intellectually savvy and well aware. They're also empowered by that education. So that in automatically makes them think, why am I worth half that of a man? Why do I lose custody of my child if, even if my husband has. I don't know. In case of addiction it's different, but d different kinds of domestic violence, it's very hard to prove it.
Don't wanna go to through that rabbit hole. But they're also aware not only, what's wonderful about this movement is that men have come on board, which is a little bit different from the Me Too movement where men were partly known as perpetrators. Now we have men as the allies.
They're saying our women deserve dignity. They deserve a status in society. That is just as, as respected as me. We, they're saying we don't want to be defined by defined that version of our women. And that's, I think, remarkable. When we look at the history, no, thank you so much. When we look at the history of Iran and Persia, it's always been so progressive and there's been a lot of, videos and photos out of Iran just before the revolution at the end of the seventies, and how it was, as you mentioned, as fashionable, as modern as any other major city in the world. And I cannot imagine the frustration level of women who had everything and then didn't. How has that echoed through your families, the women, the generations of women in Iran?
And if I'm incorrect in that assumption, please correct me. I'll speak on, oh, sorry. Was that for Sarah? Go ahead. No I also want to point out that it's still the case that it is, to be honest with you, they've managed to, despite the oppression, despite the lack of access, despite the fact that they've been put in a box and told what to do, we're talking about a system that believes they get their power, they get their life force from God, like they actually believe they are doing God's work on Earth.
And if you think about that ideology, there's they're not thinking that they're doing something against, they're not, it's not a matter of oppressing rights for them. It's a matter of doing an obligation. And what we're saying is we want to be citizens with rights instead of Muslims with obligations because how can you, for fact infer someone's a true believer if they have no choice in deciding.
And it's interesting just on your note regarding how it was before there was also oppression during the Shah era. We just wanna be very fair and honest about that, but not as much women were empowered, women were educated. There was very much emphasis on that and it's very different. But I also wanna say that Iran is still a very vibrant, youthful very modern society right now as we speak.
I think. I think that's really beautifully said. And to add to that and to answer your que question Kara about women that who had it all and then now it's totally different. I think for people who, and I have family who lived in Iran before the revolution when they were wearing, they show me pictures of, and we've all seen them online, of women wearing crop tops and short shorts expressing themselves even more freely than I ever have here.
And as a real estate advisor, I guide people through making choices for about their home. And whether that's walls and a roof or your body having the choice is everything as a woman, just as a human being for everyone, for all of us. And to have that choice taken away even if you came here before, I have family members who came here before the revolution.
It's heartbreaking to think that their home is gone. It no longer exists. The home that they grew up in, their motherland is totally different. It's turned upside down. So the women and the girls who have more courage in their pinky finger than their impress, than their oppressors have in their whole body, who, like Marjan mentioned are saying basically they have nothing to lose.
So they're saying Enough is enough. And they are, these women and girls are healing so many people around the world including men and boys. Like Mar also mentioned men are oppressed too. And I think that. This isn't just in, in Iran now, it's, we see it in a lot of other cultures too. The machismo concept and in different industries and organizations all around the world.
This affects all of us. When men are conditioned to be cut off from a really important, beautiful part of themselves, their own inner femininity, it creates this like this, I think shame that they project onto women and girls who they rape and beat to death. And men and boys are hurting too, and it's it affects everyone.
Danny, how is this all showing up in Australia and is it very in aligned with what we're seeing experiencing here based on what we've shared in the us? Yeah, look, absolutely. And because I'm just getting so many messages a lot of the people in Iran are actually using their VPN, so I have one message here where she share, she shares Dani.
My English is not very good, but I can tell you this, we die every day in this country, Danny, every day, somewhere in every part of my country, someone dies just for this natural desire to have freedom and no one can do anything about it. Every day with a bad memory of yesterday, we wake up, but we hope for good days.
Before, maybe my hope was low, but now Danny, because of you and people like you, I feel good. My hope has increased and my courage has increased. So what we were just talking about before, we're actually the people that are being, the voice for the people of Iran are just giving them that hope. And they have got so much courage.
And to me, like Sarah was saying before, they're such an inspiration. They are oh, like they've got nothing to lose. And that's why I'm standing beside them all because we don't, we have nothing to lose. People are dying every day. Yeah, I, we echo the, everything that's been discussed today here in Australia as well.
I don't think I can ever imagine at this point in my life, the degree of courage that those young women in particular are choosing to step into. There's the level of privilege you mentioned before, Sarah of the things that we are worried about in different parts of the world is. It, embarrassing in the scope of what they have to wake up to and not know what is or isn't gonna happen and to choose to do it anyway.
Like I, how can the rest of us tap into that, as Danny mentioned, to help like echo that forward because yeah I'm like, what can I do? I'll just give you more, how do we put more fuel into what you guys need? I'm always gonna jump in if Please do. I think what's very important is Danny, I, you make me very emotional.
Just on off of that, I feel like it's it's something else. When they know their lives are at risk and they go out there and fight for. The values that they believe they're, they are inherently owed. And they are, they're god-given rights, right to freedom of expression, right to life, to be free of life, to live a life where it's, where life is dignified. There's no torture imprisonment for expressing who you are, not just in as an individual, but your ideology. And I think what's incredible, and I've said this over and over again, is that this movement is relatable because it far extends the borders of Iran.
This is not just something that women in Iran have suffered from, but it is, as I said, all inclusive in that it includes different social classes despite the polarized society where we, in which I guess all around the world, but mainly in Iran, 1% of the population hold most of the wealth, 90% of the wealth, they have the power.
Unfortunately, we're dealing with a government where people have been put in positions of power, not based on merit, because of nepotism, because of connection. And this is a huge thing that people need to understand about the structures of this government that we're talking about. It is systemically put in place, put together in order to oppress and control.
It's not the kind of government where we, yes. Sharia Law as Marja VA, put perfectly, there is Sharia Law and there's interpretations of it, which are extreme. And as the other lady Marjan said, we're not fighting Islam. We're fighting the odd ideology that is extreme in its nature. It's oppress, it's meant to divide.
It's not meant to unite, it's meant to put certain people in power and then have them abuse power against the other sector of the society. And I think, just going back to your question, it is very important to understand that as an, as a structure, they don't they might necessarily not believe as MS put that they're allowed to rape people or they're out to torture people That, but.
According to a certain interpretation of Islam, which is called Haddi, where these imams come and interpret it the way they want, whichever way they please, that is true in practice. Thankfully it has not happened as much in Iran. But yes, the fact that there is this notion that is even possible gives us chills.
It's like unbearable to even think. And just going back to your question, I think being informed his, of the history of Iran, of what it's going through now, of this economic stagnation of the inflation. People come outta university with higher degrees, not able to get a job. They become taxi drivers. They work in butcher shops or supermarkets.
That's unbel for a young person. Now living in Iran, the future that like as Danny was as we was talking about dying every day. Dying every day doesn't mean literally just literally getting bullets into your chest, which they unfortunately are like subjected to. It means not having a future, not being able to dream of a future where you can feed your family, educate your children, be part of society.
These young people are on a riot. Protesting the ability not to be part of their country's future. In every other country, youth are invited to come in and vote to be part of the movement to express their descent In our country, they're receiving bullets, being beaten, imprisoned. I'm talking about geniuses, I'm talking about people who are any other country, any other university, any other, would accept them with open arms with a red carpet underneath them, asking them to fly us to the moon.
It is absolutely excruciatingly painful to say, see that, but I think information is absolutely key, knowing how to help, because they don't come from a necessarily privilege. They're not about expression, body autonomy necessarily in a sense that we know of in the West. And that is different.
Do you think that there is. Extra attention from the US in particular and Australia. I think as well, going through similar things right now of seeing what we thought were more guaranteed democracies in existence, being challenged right now where we hear echoes of what's happening in Iran and how close it is for any country to shift between what we think is stability to what we think is not.
And how are other, current political global shifts impacting the fact that everyone's listening at a higher level to Iran right now?
First of all, the Iranian women are leading their charge. They are making their voices loud enough that you are almost forced to say something about it or represent them. For instance, one of the taglines of this protest is be our voice. Why is that? Because immediately when the protest started and by the way, this is Mar Jean Chy.
I don't know that. Why the camera's not me. That's okay. So for anyone listening why is that? Because the moment the protest started, we cut the internet, we cut the mobile lines, right? So now people have to skirt their way, get VPNs. I just said, the poorest areas don't have service. They're getting like few clips out.
And I have had people send me videos and I will tell you like, okay, I send a few seconds. I can't send more. They'll see me taking videos. No, no other place in the world have you seen protests. And then people go, Hey, be your voice. Share this. Please don't let them forget about us. So I have to send messages like, we have not forget, forgotten about you.
They don't want to ask other countries for help. But what would you do if, I'm sorry to say it so bluntly, but if the enemy was your government. What would you do? The very least we can do is share their stories. The very least we can do very least is make a statement. Even if we don't give money, even we don't change the laws.
It's shocking to me that some major institutions, universities, after we saw that Sharif University students were taking hostage, have not come out and made a statement that some of the major political leaders, now I now give much gratitude to those who have, we have seen leaders in Europe, south America Australia, come, Canada come out.
The conservative party in Canada is deploring what the government is doing, showing their support, cutting their hair, politicians and other countries cutting their hair. How beautiful. The Iranian people are just asking to be our voice and they're saying, you know what? We can do this even if you don't wanna help us, just do not hurt us.
To piggyback off of what Mary John said, it's so funny saying your name 'cause I have the same name. But I think one thing that's really impactful is the age of social media. Because before perhaps there wasn't such a platform to share about exactly what's going on when it's going on.
And I say that because that's what instigated the whole movement, which was I think three weeks ago when Masa Amini was taken by the Morality police. I find that so funny. Because it's like, what even is that if you're gonna kill somebody for what they're, how they're dressed for having a piece of hair sticking out, which by the way is in no way in alignment with any religion that I know of.
So I think that. A lot of these officials and a lot of these officers have taken, not even necessarily their interpretation, but taken what, taken advantage of what they can with their religion and turned it into, this is now my justification for inflicting harm on another person. And it just like begs the question of like, where is your consciousness in all this?
Like where do you land on morality, as you'd say in all this? And so back to the massive thing, they projected this for the world to see that this girl was taken and she was beaten primarily. I think she died from like blunt force trauma to her head. And they labeled it as a heart attack, which is it's gosh, if you can't even have be dignified in life, like at least have some, at least per.
Perceive or at least impart some dignity in their death, which is also the same thing that happened to two of the other Girls Haw Academy and then Sarina, I think, or Es same thing. Like they were badly beaten to death. But what's and the mother of Show Academy came out yesterday or the day before and made a statement about, okay, here's what they want me to say and here's what I'm actually saying.
And so I think what's so powerful is that now with social media, it's created this, okay, we're going to spread this awareness everywhere so that those officials can't actually take the steps that they would ordinarily be able to take. And people aren't just going to sit there and give your rendition of the story.
They're not just gonna say, my daughter died of a heart attack. No, my daughter died of blunt force trauma after she was repeatedly beat and raped and then, finally killed. So I think that. That's one good thing. That's one good thing that we have here as a resource for ourselves that we can spread awareness.
But what's so heartbreaking for a lot of us, I think, is that I was sharing with some of the ladies in this group that I feel so strangely connected to the people in Iran right now, especially the women. I feel like it's in my DNA and I have absolutely no idea what they're going through. And I can't even say that I do.
'cause I'm sitting here on my end of the world with all my privilege, not having ever experienced, tinner mining experiences, minor experiences when I've gone to Iran, I've had people on the streets like, tell me to correct my veil or to, I think they can tell when you're a foreigner just by the way you walk and talk, et cetera.
And it's been like, I remember my mom's just don't let it, don't let it bother you. But it got on my nerves. I was like, what is it to this person? And she's a woman. She's a woman. And she's telling me that I have to dress a certain way and I'm sitting here are you kidding me?
And but really I think I can only appreciate like a tiny little percentage of what these girls are going through. And it's hard for me to, in a way, like I'm not the one jumping in front of bullets. So I think that's another thing to keep in mind is I can sit here and go, Hey, women in Iran, you're doing great things.
But I'm really, I'm sitting on my end of the world with all my privilege. And I have absolutely no idea what they're really, truly going through. And I'm, my hope, and I think through this talk and through raising the awareness, is that enough of this is projected to the world. Enough of this is brought to light to where.
Something actually shifts in Iran for the better. And who knows, like maybe a woman will come to power. That's what I'd like to see is a woman comes to power. And for kind of all of this stuff that's been happening and looming in the background to quiet down and for people to be able to just live their life and have the basic rights that they should be afforded and to be able to reap the benefits of a very wealthy country.
'cause Iran is a very wealthy country with a lot of resources and there's enough wealth to go around and unfortunately that's not currently what's happening. Do you think that now is when leadership in Iran will shift, how close are we to it actually shifting?
Just a couple of notes because the ladies pointed out two things that were very important, I think for everyone to, to know in that put it beautifully. It's so wonderful to see how the social movement network movement has helped this civil movement, this sort of civil disobedience. And we have made diff a difference, like you, just to your question, we have already made a difference.
We've united, we've we're about to organize, we are now informed, and more importantly, inside Iran, my father was saying how, and they've gone around and women already have taken their scarves off with police officers across them actually protecting them. So this in a sense, might not be enough for US observers from the outside, but I think every little count and every move towards that.
Ideal freedom, whatever that is, is very important to understand. But I also just please let me know if I'm jumping ahead. I just, regarding social network, I just internet, we were talking about Mar was. Pointing out the blockage of internet, something we, they call digital authoritarianism.
It's something a lot of dictatorships use because they know it's a very effective tool for the population, especially the young to collaborate, to organize and form each other of what's going on. There's no longer this dark room and you can commit atrocities without the world knowing you'll have to pay for your sins.
And I think shedding that spotlight has been incredible. Celebrities like Justin Bald UA Lipa today many, all the French ladies that I can go on, I'm such an admirer of French cinema. So that's, that just has been like my, the highlights for me in a lot of ways have joined in set. Every little count, every platform is important.
Every one of us have the chance to make a difference because people listen. And when people listen when minds change, leaders can no longer ignore us. That's where the transformative nature of the movement kicks in. But what's very important, and I wanna quickly point out, is what used to happen in years in terms of civil disobedience or movement in seven years, eight years, 10 years?
Harvey Milk, Martin Luther King, it used to be planned organized, had the leadership, had members join in, and there was a lot of substance and foundation built around it. Now, today, we can gather thousands of people by submitting, like putting posters on social media and people will come and there will be a huge population who will show up.
But we don't have a purpose after that. We don't have a mission to follow. We don't have a substance to, we don't have a program. And I think we need to be aware of what social media gives us. But what it lacks, and that is substance, that is a foundation that we can work off of to something else because great, all well and wonderful for people to come out amazingly effective.
But what happens after that is important. We have people sign petitions, but do you know what you're actually signing? Do you know what, where that is gonna go? Do you know what's gonna happen after that? Because we're here in West where we're talking about privilege. We're in a position of privilege because we feel that signing something or being part of the marches relieves us from our civil duties.
We have done it. We've done this podcast, we've talked, it's over. No, it's not. It's just the beginning. It's the first step. And that leads me directly to what would success look like? What are the core asks that when will we know that we've achieved? One step forward or all the steps forward that everyone's looking for?
What are those asks that everyone's making, please? Marja. Kara, that's Kara. I don't know why the camera's not on me, but I'll be quick. It's a complicated answer to be honest with you. A lot of the Iran people are wanna talk about right now. They say we will get there. I believe we are in the middle of a revolution.
They don't even like to call it that. These are just protests. They are protesting every day. They have been protesting every day for 22 days. Currently, right now, today there are over 200 protests. In cities around the world outside of Iran. Last week there was over 150. So this is growing. People are noticing we are in the middle of a revolution.
And the revolution takes time. It takes over a year where the infrastructure goes down. We will see what will be put in its place. It will be much closer in regards to female equality. I believe at this time, now that it's 2022, by the time new laws are acted, it'll be 20 23, 20 24, that it will likely be 50 50.
But that is really a prediction. This is just gonna take time. And they don't even wanna discuss that. They say, can we please take these people down?
Yeah, and I think it's really important to note as well on the dwindling avenues or for political pushback, or that there is really no hope for reform right now, which is fueling this mass mobilization people are at a point of desperation that we've never seen before. In the green movement. There was, brought in an already established political figure to spearhead that in hopes that maybe if we can get someone in office.
With policy that is a little bit less oppressive, but right now this is a leaderless movement. This is the first time we're seeing a movement that is by the people, for the people to really capitalize on that. And I think what Pega was touching on earlier with this widespread traumatization that is happening, healing also has this sort of canopy effect.
So if we can continue in these conversations, if we can make these women feel heard and feel noted, we can also create a sort of positive feedback loop of inspiring others and keeping this conversation going, and really recognizing their level of desperation to, to keep dismantling the forces that be and look at later steps once we've done.
What is it that is giving you guys equally the most frustration and equally the most hope right now?
I think we can all answer that one by one, that I would love to hear everyone. Yeah, go ahead Pega. No, you go ahead. It's okay. I'll go after you. Okay. The thing that gives me the most frustration is that given the size of what is going on, that they are not only the regime is still trying to recruit their army, recruit so many different aspects of their military and government, which half the people don't even want to be participating in, but.
That frustrates me that they are not not, they haven't all left the country. That is usually what happens at the beginning of the revolution. All of their children have left the country. It also frustrates me that a lot of the western countries have not spoken out against it. A lot of leaders or are speaking out very late.
But what encourages me is the 13-year-old girls. The 12-year-old girls. I don't know that having grown up in America, I ha would've had the will to do that, but they are probably frustrated from such a young age. They don't want to become, someone who's married at 15 or 16. They want to be educated.
The fact that I'm seeing these little girls protest, take off their hijab, push out their school administrator, I think that has given e everybody hope. Can you imagine? Can you imagine your. 13-year-old is going out to protest your 12-year-old girl. How would you feel as a mother? But even the mothers aren't telling all of the, are telling their kids to stay home 'cause they also want a better future for their kids.
Go ahead. Yeah. So what frustrates me is that change isn't happening right now. I think we all want it. We're we've had enough. But we have to remember, I think it's important to remember it took, what, 40 plus years to get here and it's gonna take time. And so we have to really prepare ourselves, like Sarah mentioned, like how can we help in concrete ways, like compassion fatigue is a real thing.
We're all like energized now, but over time people are gonna forget or get busy with their day-to-day lives. And we really have to have programs. I don't know, I don't have the solutions, but we really need to carve out time to continue this conversation at the very least and try to find solutions and know that it'll take time.
And to be patient with one another. And what gives me hope is that what's different, I think this time than back in the late seventies. During the revolution back then was women, people protested back then too, but there wasn't eyes on them like there is now thanks to social media, thanks to the internet.
I think that a big part of it is, yes, women and girls are saying, we have nothing to lose. Enough is enough. And the men and boys who support them too and they know that the world is watching and they're hopeful that, we'll be their voice as Mar mentioned, the other marriage I mentioned.
And yeah, I feel like we as human beings, we have a duty to be their voice, and this gives me so much hope because by healing others, we heal ourselves. Thank you, harissa.
Sure. Just to even piggyback off of that as well by healing them, we do heal ourselves. We even see based on in my own field in psychotherapy, we see how trauma is embedded within our DNA within our genetics. Whenever our families, whenever our predecessors go through such massive political trauma, it embeds itself in how we then respond just out of sheer survival.
And so by participating in these conversations, by elevating their voices, we're healing our own lineages as well. So I really, if I can get any message out today, it would be if you have ever experienced oppression within your family, if you are an immigrant, a first generation, second generation, or have friends who are immigrants or have any kind of experience with.
With what it is to feel so helpless. Then the sheer act of participating in these conversations and staying informed in cultivating spaces for compassionate conversation and dialogue, you are healing yourself and those around you. It is so critical to do and I think that by creating that space as well and by really inviting our Western counterparts to engage in conversation and curiosity, that's the best thing we can do to upkeep this momentum.
I read a 16-year-old girl, say earlier today, president Biden, the smell of oil is so thick, it masks the smell of our blood. And so if we can continue to place the spotlight on things that matter and really pressure our government to really supersede their own political interests, we can make massive change.
Thank you. Danny, how about you? Yeah, look, same here. The frustration obviously with what all the ladies were saying, but also inspired by the female students. Just recently when they had the president come to their universities, they were chanting, get lost at the Iranian president.
So just for them to actually just speak those words to, this regime, I'm just I'm so excited that they have that voice. I've just recently embarked in the fashion industry, so I'm a little bit excited that the big brands like Gucci and Bales, I can't even pronounce their names.
And even the likes of the Kim Kardashians of the world sharing this message and they've got a pretty large audience. So I'm excited about that. Marjan. So I have two big frustrations, actually. One of them more of a heartbreak. I'm heartbroken and I. Anyone with a heart is also can empathize in seeing like these really young girls dying for absolutely no reason at the hands of really.
Barbaric methods of ending someone's life. That's really heartbreaking. It's hard to watch. I've had to like, take breaks from social media because it's just it's too much to bear in a way. And again, I have no real appreciation for what their families are facing. The other frustration I have is I wanna be able to take my white husband to Iran.
And show him how beautiful of a country it is. It is so beautiful. And the last time I was there, I got to enjoy all the amazing food and go to all the beautiful places. And we have, Kara, you've been in our family parties. Our culture is so rich with love and warmth and food and dancing.
And that's just, that's exactly what all the people in Iran want to be able to express to the fullest degree. And I feel frustrated that more people don't know this is what Iran actually looks like. It's not this like desert that with people, prancing around on camels, like it's, doesn't look like that.
It's actually a really beautiful country. And I've gotten to venture to a lot of the different places and I'm telling my husband, oh, I just wanna take you to Eson and I wanna take you to Persepolis and Shira, and there's these castles that I want to take you to see, and I wanna take my kids there one day.
And so my frustration. In that, and so much of my family, I have 45 first cousins and they're all in Iran. Pretty much. I have some family interspersed over the US. The vast majority are back home. And then what gives me hope are like the Dan's of the world are, are the HEROs of the world, the Amandas of the world, the Annas of the world.
And all my, obviously brothers and sisters that are also Persian, but just everyone that's not and is so passionate about what's going on and wants to expedite the process as Pago was saying. Let's get, let's do this, let's get it done. Come on. But also just I want to inform the world.
And Danny, like she mentioned, she has a big platform and she's sharing about it all the time. It's in her bio is it's like the colors of the Iranian flag. And Sarah does too. And like Balenciaga, Gucci, like all these real, and Hozier actually heard about that girl sorry, now who sang his song and he was really deeply saddened by it.
And so that gives me so much hope because I'm like, oh my God, people are actually listening to what's happening there. And I feel like that's really what's gonna propagate the change. Thank you, Sarah.
To be honest with you, I'm not sure if frustration is the word, because having dedicated seven years of my life to human rights, I've. I think gathered an insignificant amount of knowledge about the politics of the world and how human rights works in general, sadly, but I want to be optimistic about its future, but just off of the politics of the world I literally had this speech prepared saying, dear Mr.
President, and that's how it began. It was my letter. I was like, I don't know if you can hear me, but this and this and that. I not only I couldn't vote, but I did calls, I gathered values. I explained to people that it is about voting for someone who stands by ideals and values that you believe in, regardless of what the politics, their international politics is about.
Because ultimately, America, France, all the big shots, they will always prioritize their national interests over other countries. This is a fact. So now that we're talking about nuclear, it's just a facade to basically, or we're talking about a lot of other things as I think Pega and Mar put.
It is about oil. It. And I think now Choky said it's about the oil stupid. It's about the oil. And this was long before this had started. And now with the current state of Russia and the fact that gas is missing and they need that, and even I had never thought that it would be hard for Mr.
Truder to say that this, these, this regime, this, these, the SEPA is a terrorist for all means and purposes. But he did. And that just goes to show, or the fact that President Biden, or Ms. Kamala Harris, who stands by the ideals of women's rights is in a lot of ways holds the torch. The beacon of hope for women around the world has barely mentioned and has maintained a very neutral stance.
That does hurt me. It doesn't frustrate me. It makes me think about what I need to do. And if I were to just put. Just outta the top of my head, the four bullet points is that we need to one unite, we need to put our ideas about what it should be. How do you say, what we abide by the ideologies, the schools of thoughts aside, and think about the main interests of the society.
That's number one. Two is nu organization planning, because we're missing the, how do you say, the traditional structures of activism. Now We need to find ways to understand what the society needs, how it gets information, how it's informed, how it's mobilized. We need, I was talking to my friends, I said, we need one source to get the information from.
We need just an Instagram page to know how the protests, when the protests are happening. Who can offer what. And then for these organizations, be it not an NGO or just a separate organization, people then, like Pega can offer their real estate advice and be like, this is what we can do in this. Or whatever.
Or Danny can say, I ga I'll gather and donations from the fashion industry, then what have you and what have you. And I, Paris had just pointed out something very incredible. And that is what we, a lot of us immigrants experience. And that is the guilt, the survival, guilt, survivor's guilt.
And we need to be able to channel that frustration and that anger and that sadness into something that is useful. Remind ourselves that we're in a position of privilege. Okay, what can we do? We can de I can definitely what I always. Tell a lot of my friends, I said, I cannot ask people to go risk their lives outside when time comes, when I can offer them reciprocally the same amount in value as someone's life, then I can ask them to go out there and risk their lives.
Until then, I need to find strategic, practical, organized, hopefully with leadership, and as Maran put it out, that comes slowly into a movement that is effective for people inside, which we go back to being of service for people that are at the front lines of this. I echo so much of what all of you have shared and when I started an organization called Powerful Ladies, I did not realize that.
It was ultimately a human rights organization that was accidentally being created. And I think what has, what I've been illuminated to is how disappointed I am in people who speak ideals and then never echo it, never do it, never take the actions. And I think there are so many people we've had hope in who just aren't walking the walk.
And so I wanna keep having conversations with women like all of you who are saying, I'll do it. I'll stand up, I'll hold your hands. And I think that's so much of the power of what we have an option to do. And where Powerful Ladies came from was just wanting to remind each other that you're not alone.
And I think that really ties back into what you've all shared about the most powerful thing that we can do right now today for the women of Iran is to keep telling them, you're not alone. We see you. We hear you. We're holding hands symbolically with you and don't ever think that you are by yourself because you're not.
So it, I just wanna quickly say, I was just gonna say, Amanda, it's not just like a trend for a 24 hour campaign that we're doing either. So this is my fourth week and I'm posting every single day. And even though my work and brands may not like me posting while I've got a certain outfit or what have you, they're still actually supporting me as well because I said, how can I possibly work when there are women and children and men dying?
This is not part of humanity. I can't pretend, hi everyone, I'm just, wearing this amazing outfit, but my, friends in Iran are just dying. Or as Sarah was saying, even just the hope of just their life, they're just slowly dying because everything's been taken and stripped off them.
So that's one thing that I'm just really passionate about, is just continue every day, even if it's just one little post. Just make sure that we're their voices every day. Yeah. Amazing. And thank you. One thing that we are committed to with these powerful conversations is that they're not a one-time scenario.
And so I will be inviting all of you back and we'll figure out what the frequency makes sense. If it's six months from now, if it's four months we'll figure out what that looks like because we don't want this to be a one and done conversation at all. I'm gonna let all of you give a final share to everyone listening to final expression of what you wanna make sure people know, actions to take how you want to be of service with each other.
I'm gonna start again with Marjan as she was such an instigator and making sure this all came together. So thank you, Marjan. Thank you for having me. It's been such a joy. It's been a joy to hear from all these other amazing ladies from different backgrounds. I think the question was, how, what was the question?
Cara? Say it again. It was a final wrap up statement. What you wanna say. Okay. You would make sure we know, all the things. I think definitely one of the biggest things is just stay involved. Don't let the fire die out. And I'm saying that to myself too. Don't go back to the way things were.
This is the time, especially now, that people are getting tired in Iran. And they need support, they need additional support. So keep the conversation going, like you said. Share as much as you can. Learn as much as you can and link arms with anyone you know in any way you can.
People are taking donations right now in Iran, so if that's something that compels you forward, then please, take that step. People are nominating share song for a Grammy, please. For, I think it's the Grammy for the best song for social change. Please nominate him 'cause I think he's absolutely deserving of that.
And just stay informed, learn the history and feel free to connect to any one of us. I'd love to have more conversations and make more friends and connections in this arena. Beautiful. Thank you Marjon. Great. I just wanna echo what the women of Iran are asking, which is to not forget about them to be their voice.
Please, repost, reshare if you feel awkward about it. If your page is not political, guess nobody's page is political. Up until now, this is about human rights. This is about women's rights, it's about doing. The right thing. Over 80% of the population of Iran is Gen Z. There's just a few old people on the, in the top who's trying to hold on to power.
They will get toppled down. You will, you may get exhausted seeing the stories and may be hard to see the photos. Just imagine living it. Please repost if you can. And if you don't have the time to go to the protest or you don't feel comfortable donating you can do one repost. You can sign an Amnesty International, pledge.
They just require your email and, and your first name. If you get emails from them, you can unsubscribe, but just, signing your name, it's so quick. You can do it in under 30 seconds. Perfect. Thank you Parisa. Yeah. So I think really digging deep within ourselves and finding ways that we can engage in a sustainable way.
I think someone mentioned earlier compassion fatigue and how real that is. And digging deep within your own personal and professional networks. If you're a writer, write blog posts. If you're an artist, create protest signage. If you're an educator, carve out five minutes for your students to be able to air out what they know and what they'd like to know.
Just finding ways that make sense for you and your immediate community to think globally, but act locally so that we can sustain this conversation and we can keep the momentum going. Beautiful. Thank you Pega. Yeah. When Maja asked me to join this conversation, it was an immediate last yes. Literally anything she asked me.
I don't think I've ever said no. Like it's always a yes because, maja has this wonderful way of being real. And when I, as a recovering perfectionist, when I wanna fall back into my old patterns of wanting everything to be rainbows and butterflies and unicorns Marja helps me keep it real. And I think it's really hard when you're proud.
A lot of cultures like ours are, we're very proud people. Reliance hard of a lion. At the same time, like Danny said, oh my gosh, Danny, like your outer beauty is just a reflection of your inner beauty. You saying like, how can I work when it's just, it like really? It's just the fact that you're sharing daily, you don't have to do that.
And you're, the fact that you're doing that is just so beautiful. And I think that you're an example of the fact that we all know what we need to do the root cause of why we don't do it. I don't know. Maybe it's because I'll share from my experiences, like maybe being too proud. And just like we do spring cleaning of our home, it has to get, a little messy before it gets better.
And and that's okay. And Sarah, you mentioned that I brought up oil, actually it wasn't me. I can't take up credit for that. It was parisa and it was I wrote this down. The smell of oil is so strong, it masks the smell of our blood. Yes. Is that how you said it? Parisa Oh my gosh. Yeah, I think the next time someone tries to talk about religion being the problem or a slew of other reasons, those are all distractions.
It's okay for us to call bullshit and on, on all these distractions and stay focused on what this really is about. It's a country of, valuable resources and and people are paying for it with their blood and it's not right. So we all know the right thing to do and we're doing it.
And I thank you all. Thank you, Danny. I think I've said enough because I'm sharing every day. But yeah, that's just my message to my community. And, I just hope even if they've just got one follower or 10 million, that it just ricochets and we just spread this blanket of peace worldwide and that we can connect regularly and that we can reshare our posts as well.
And yeah, it's really important to just stay connected every day. Thank you so much. And Sarah God, I, even, the closing argument could go on and on, so I'll just briefly say I agree with so many of the ladies that pointed out local activism. Be it making a poster or signing a petition. However, I also want people to know that there is this notion that leaders are the real change makers, and that is not necessarily true.
Even though yes, alliances matter, brokering relationships with them, creating a table where we can all sit and discuss. In an ideal world, absolutely yes. But I think what's even more important, and also just regarding the petition naty, what I want everyone to understand is that international law is a system based on agreement of states.
So it's not binding and they don't have executive power. It's very important for people to know that because we think that once we do that, we can just put it off and the wind will carry it wherever it may be, and everything will be jolly and fine. Unfortunately, it's not, and we've seen that with Syria.
The General Assembly created a mechanism, an investigative mechanism, and for five years now, nothing has happened because the states are abusing the power are the very states that block us from entering and do the, doing those investigations. So we need to do more than that, and that is putting people at the top under so much pressure that they cannot ever ignore us.
Now, Danny put says it beautifully, we need to keep the momentum going. We need to keep posting, informing, putting it out there. Yes, absolutely. But just going for further than that, regarding the movement and the revolutionary we're talking about right now, in this day, age, and this is factual, this is a Harvard study.
Movements are not about the size. It's about the skill of the organization, of that movement. And that is very important to know. And I wanna add to that durability. The dur, if this goes on it is not, as we were talking about a very young population, it's bound to change anyway. It's not a matter of if, but a matter of when.
We want to make sure less people are under threat, vulnerable to brutality and violence, and worse yet lose their lives. And also we want to make sure that those lives were not lost in vain and that this will come to fruition to and we will forever honor their memories, sadly. But with all our, with everything we have, we will go, I have no doubt that we will get Iran back.
I will no doubt that through this movement, many non Iranians have become Iranian, have joined us, and we're fuck. I'm sorry, for lack of a better word, wonderful about it, is that now Iran is now this symbol of justice and freedom and we've all this is something everyone can unite behind and we can observe it in Australia, we can see it in France.
We can, and as everyone put out beautifully, it's not about against being against Muslims, being against Islam, it's being against Islamism extremism where we're controlled, not given rights.
Thank you so much. I, IQ it's such an honor to, and I am continually humbled by. Who says yes and who is on board to share and share your perspectives and to be a voice for those who are voiceless. I'm humbled that you guys were a yes to be here today and to take time out of your day and everything else you have going on to be here.
I know that all of powerful ladies and all of the powerful humans and men that are alongside with us. We have so much going on, and the decision fatigue is real. The distraction fatigue is real. And it is so important to keep talking about this and talking about everything else that we want to see change.
And it gives me the ability to sleep at night knowing that the entire burden is not on my own shoulders, but we're all sharing it to some extent. So thank you for sharing this. Thank you for being powerful ladies. I cannot wait to continue this conversation. And as always I am here to continue to be a connector and a collaborator.
So please make bold requests of myself and everyone else here and those who are part of powerful ladies. Thank you guys so much for your time today. Yeah, thank you, Kai. Thank you. Thank you guys. Everybody, you're an inspiration. Yes. Thank you guys so much. So for all the panelists, what's next is this will be coming out as our live episode this Wednesday for the podcast.
All of the things to share it will be sent with you guys. But please, everyone who's listening, tell your friends to share the episode, to pass it along, to use it as a tool for more information. We will continue to be sharing in our platform, power Pro Ladies and my own everything we're able to gather from these women and everything else that is happening.
But go be amazing. You guys are incredible and we will keep changing the world. Thank you guys. Thank you. Thank you for having me. See. Of course. My pleasure. I'll be stalking all you all on. Yeah. Yes, please do. Sorry. Sorry, ladies. Bye. No, bye. Thank you.
All the links that connect with our amazing panelists are in our show notes@thepowerfulladies.com. Please subscribe to this podcast wherever you're listening and share this episode with those who should hear it. Come join us on Instagram at Powerful Ladies, and if you're looking to connect directly with me, visit kara duffy.com or Kara Duffy on Instagram.
I'll be back next week with a brand new episode. Until then, I we're taking on being powerful in your life. Go be awesome and up to something you love.
I am Kara Duffy, and this is The Powerful Ladies Podcast. This episode is a live and unedited recording of a powerful conversation series, the Rise in Empowerment of Women in Iran. This recording took place on Saturday, October 8th, 2022, in response to and support of the protests happening in Iran being led by brave young women.
Asking for freedom for Women Life and Liberty. Our amazing panelists include Dr. Marjan Cusa Johnson, a physician and entrepreneur, Dr. Marjan Achi, a board certified dermatologist, Parisa Frost, a marriage, family, and clinical art therapist and cultural researcher, Pega Gamar, a real estate advisor, Danny Stevens, model mother and motivator.
And Sarah Ed, human rights lawyer, actor and activist. Enjoy this episode and please do share it so that the efforts of the women and girls in Iran is being heard by as many people as possible.
Welcome to the Powerful Ladies conversation about the rise in empowerment of women in Iran. I am very honored today to have amazing women who are much more knowledgeable about Iran and its history and its culture and what's going on than I am. I'm so honored that they said yes. I'm quickly going to screen share so you can get a preview of what who are panelists are and we'll be talking about today.
This is who we have today. We are very lucky to have these women here. They're taking time out. There are protests literally happening right now around the world. And they took their time to come and talk to you guys. I'm gonna open it up first with Marjon Kha Johnson, who is the instigator for this conversation.
Marjan, would you please introduce yourself, tell everyone where you are in the world and why this matters so much to you. Hi everybody. I'm Marjan. Yes, I'm Marjan Kha Johnson. I am in in Laguna, California. And I. Felt very compelled to have something like this and connect with Kara because everything that's going on in Iran, it's not the first time this has happened.
This is like one of many revolutions that have happened, but this is the first time females have been at the forefront of things. So I just felt okay, as a female living outside Iran, it's my duty and responsibility to spread awareness about it and and do really whatever it is that I possibly can, which in this context, not being there has been telling the world, telling everyone I know and getting other people involved.
So I'm really excited to be here and chatting with everyone. Thank you so much. And from there we'll jump to our second beautiful marj of the day. Same questions. Where are you? How do you say your whole name and why does this matter to you? Okay. Thank you for having me. I am Dr. Marjan Vici. I'm in Orange County, California.
And this matters because we are witnessing people that are frustrated that they do not have basic human rights on a personal level. And I live outside of Iran. I have been hearing stories ever since I was a child of what rights women do not have, which is basic rights as if they don't even have the right to child custody, should they have a divorce.
But that is just, the tip of the iceberg. The more I find out, the more disturbing it is. What these individuals are asking for is so basic that I cannot help but be involved. And I think the more that people learn about it, they will feel the same way. Perfect. Thank you. Hi, my name is Patti Saro.
I'm based out of Los Angeles, California. And really just to echo what the first Mar two mjs have said. There's such an absence of fundamental human rights and this has gone on for so long, and it wasn't always the case. We've heard stories from our mothers and grandmothers of the rights and liberties that they enjoyed prior to this oppressive regime, and we've essentially gone into this tyrannical time machine and hopped back tens, hundreds of years, and for what?
And so to really amplify these voices and to amplify these stories of these women so that they're not dying in vain, that's my main reason for being here, to really pay homage to that bravery and doing whatever I can to amplify their screams. Thank you, Sarah.
Hi everybody. My name is Sarah Sayed. I'm currently based in la it is an absolute pleasure to be amongst all of you. Thank you to your audience for tuning in. I think that this is probably one of the most important parts of being part of this movement. And also empo empowering people inside, being informed constantly listening to those who have something to say.
Let's say this. I would like to say, I would like to just not only remember, but also give praise to my brothers and sisters back home. They've not only been inspiring, but they've been transformed, like their movement has transformed many people who it has touched in ways that have inspired them.
Compelled them to do something in, in an extraordinary way. And I give, I, we all are here just trying to be of service to them and to their movement. And hopefully this will stay alive and we'll keep kicking and we'll keep supporting them as best as we can. Thank you, Danny.
Good morning from Australia. I was so passionate to join this morning. I think I woke up at 3:00 AM but then my body just naturally woke up at about 4:30 AM So it is my honor and privilege to be with all of you beautiful women. And Sarah said, I have a platform and I want to be able to be the voice of Iran.
And I don't think we were born in, like today to watch our brothers and sisters and daughters and granddaughters suffer the atrocities that we are seeing today. So I want this to end today. So I stand with the women and people of Iran. I. Love it. Thank you, Pega.
Hi there. I'm here in La Jolla, San Diego, California. And just like Danny and others have said this is such an important time to come together. And remember our interdependence just around the world we're what, seven, 8 billion sisters and brothers. And if one of us is hurting, all of us are hurting.
And even though I wasn't, I was born here, born and raised here in the us just because I am not in the same circumstances as the people who are going through so much in Iran, doesn't mean that. I can't empathize that I can't, that I haven't had those same feelings. And I think that I bring this up because, not because it's about me, but because I think that whoever's on here, whoever's listening can also relate because we've all felt devalued.
I don't care if you're a woman, a man, if you identify with what you identify with, if everyone has experienced being devalued and or at least knows someone that they care about who's been devalued. And so from this place of being human, we can support one another and we must support one another.
Thank you guys. So I'm gonna open up with the first question, which is, just getting really clear with everyone about what is actually happening on the ground. You know that we've seen there be a rise in teenagers protesting in school, people protesting on the streets, men stepping up to support women in ways they never have before.
And then the internet has been cut out, which I've been told is so that we don't see the atrocities of what's happening. The last count I also heard was that there were something around 130 confirmed deaths from the protests that are happening, and more and more women keep being found that have been go, gone missing, unfortunately dead.
That's what I know. That is what I know from News Clips that I've been able to grab in snippets. So who knows more and who wants to share about the realities of what's on the street right now? Go ahead, Marja, jump in. Yeah, this is a jump in. So just as you guys feel compelled, unmute. So I think I mentioned this previously, but there was an, a similar revolution green movement that happened.
I think it was 2009, 2010, something like that. I could be off, but similarly, there was an uprising. So one of the biggest fundamental issues like Marjan pointed out in Iran is that women don't have basic rights. And that's the right to ride a bicycle, and that's the right to have custody of their children after divorce, leave the country if they're married, et cetera, if their husband doesn't allow for that.
Now, the other problem that's really, I think, fueled a lot of this fire, and it also did back when it initially had happened, the first revolution was that. There's so many people living in poverty in Iran. And when I say that it's like this singer songwriter Shevin had written a song about it, about how like, parents can't provide their kids with things that we really take for granted here.
And I think, that's a big propellant for a lot of people to speak up because I think they're just, they've got nothing to lose anymore. And that's why we're seeing generation Z girls, 16-year-old girls out in the streets throwing off their hijab and burning it or stepping on pictures of the supreme leaders from the past.
And what I really wanna make clear though is that I have no religiou affiliation. But this is not in any way, shape or form a rise against Islam. I think that a lot of people collapse the two and they're afraid to speak out about it because of that reason. Because they're like, oh, I don't wanna seem Islamophobic.
And it's absolutely not that. It's a woman's right to choose and not, and in here a woman's right to choose is a completely different conversation there. A woman's right to choose. She dresses, if she can ride a bike, how she composes herself if she would like a divorce, without having to get the permission of 15 other people to do and then for families to be able to afford bread, I was in Iran before I started medical school, and I saw people that like, they couldn't afford to go have chicken for dinner. It's just it's atrocious. And so I think that coupled with the fact that they're so oppressed, women are so oppressed.
Even the men are oppressed in a lot of ways. Be gay. That's not allowed. You will be killed if you are found to be gay. That oppression, I think has caused this upheaval of I've just got nothing to lose anymore, so I'm gonna throw myself out there in this movement hoping that some change will come as a result of it.
To speak farther on that you are asking what is people don't know or what is not being shown and it's very dark. There's a reason they're cutting the internet. And the worst part is, we have these videos coming out from the major cities. Tehran Mashhad, but, and where people have cell phones, but some of the poorest regions where nobody really has a cell phone is where we're seeing just vile behavior of the local government.
About eight days ago in Balu, Tristan, which is very poor region where they don't even have the proper medical care that they need the local guards there just fired into the protestors. Children, adults o over a hundred people were injured, but over 80 died, including children. And they call, they're now calling it Bloody Friday, but it's very dark.
For instance in just preparing for this podcast, I learned that there is a government law, of course there, this is fake Islam, but they're saying that in Islamic law that prison guards can rape people who are being kept in the prisons. Men and women, even though being gay is illegal, that if you pray before the rape takes place, then it's legal and lawful.
So I can't even imagine if somebody, now speaking on what Marin said, regarding the poverty level, over 50% of Iranians live be below the poverty line, which is where you're seeing this frustration. This is how they live every day. So imagine you steal bread to feed your family, and now you're in prison and you get to be raped, day by day from guards.
None of this makes sense. I'm surprised this information is something that's not public, but it is easy to not think about or talk about. This is why we need the support of un, we need allies all over the world because, and we've heard this before, that if there are not basic human rights everywhere, it's a threat to human rights.
You know where we are as well.
And there. Oh, Sarah, please. Hi. Hi. Oh hi everyone. Just wonderful conversation. Just piggybacking off the ladies, but also on a much, much lighter note. I want to say that it is very important to know that women have always been part of movements that have ever occurred historically in Iran.
What we're seeing now that is different and incredible in a sense is that it's all inclusive. Women used to, women have been beside, student movements have been beside union. Strikes have been historically synergistically involved in every other type of movement. What's important now is that it's spearheaded by women.
So we need to always understand that there is this narrative that. We tend to overanalyze in West in that women want autonomy, they want the freedom of self-expression, which they absolutely do. But what is different also that we need to understand is that it comes from not to separate but basically delineate between the two.
Is that here in West we're more about body autonomy, self-expression. You can say partly in a, from a privileged perspective, whilst in Iran, women are not just oppressed socially, they're oppressed politically, economically civil wise. And if there is a hierarchy of rights, be it the always obviously economical status and civil being the triggers underneath it.
So there is this undercurrent of women not being able to hold positions in office positions of power, be judges, be involved in the judiciary in a sense that is, effective be in offices and also safety. Because there is this notion that, there's this constant rhetoric being reiterated by the patriarchy that exists, that women wouldn't be safe doing certain types of jobs.
But what's very important, and I want everyone who's not been to Iran for a long time, I actually have not myself, I've been away for 10 years. I partly because of my activism. But I was born and I grew up there. I'm, I was literally, I used to wear the hijab. I used to wear the scarves at school. I used to actually wear veil.
I used to go to a school where we had to wear chador. The long black veil. What's very important is to know that this generation and the generation before, they're very smart. They're intellectual, they're very connected to the west. I would say very vibrant and very much, energized to connect to the world.
Internet has exacerbated that in, in so many good ways. But when you think of a population that is very young very in touch with the world, when we talk about fashion, you go to Tehran and is unbelievable. It's like Paris. We are talking about a six 65% of higher educated people. People who graduate are girls.
They're not just intellectually savvy and well aware. They're also empowered by that education. So that in automatically makes them think, why am I worth half that of a man? Why do I lose custody of my child if, even if my husband has. I don't know. In case of addiction it's different, but d different kinds of domestic violence, it's very hard to prove it.
Don't wanna go to through that rabbit hole. But they're also aware not only, what's wonderful about this movement is that men have come on board, which is a little bit different from the Me Too movement where men were partly known as perpetrators. Now we have men as the allies.
They're saying our women deserve dignity. They deserve a status in society. That is just as, as respected as me. We, they're saying we don't want to be defined by defined that version of our women. And that's, I think, remarkable. When we look at the history, no, thank you so much. When we look at the history of Iran and Persia, it's always been so progressive and there's been a lot of, videos and photos out of Iran just before the revolution at the end of the seventies, and how it was, as you mentioned, as fashionable, as modern as any other major city in the world. And I cannot imagine the frustration level of women who had everything and then didn't. How has that echoed through your families, the women, the generations of women in Iran?
And if I'm incorrect in that assumption, please correct me. I'll speak on, oh, sorry. Was that for Sarah? Go ahead. No I also want to point out that it's still the case that it is, to be honest with you, they've managed to, despite the oppression, despite the lack of access, despite the fact that they've been put in a box and told what to do, we're talking about a system that believes they get their power, they get their life force from God, like they actually believe they are doing God's work on Earth.
And if you think about that ideology, there's they're not thinking that they're doing something against, they're not, it's not a matter of oppressing rights for them. It's a matter of doing an obligation. And what we're saying is we want to be citizens with rights instead of Muslims with obligations because how can you, for fact infer someone's a true believer if they have no choice in deciding.
And it's interesting just on your note regarding how it was before there was also oppression during the Shah era. We just wanna be very fair and honest about that, but not as much women were empowered, women were educated. There was very much emphasis on that and it's very different. But I also wanna say that Iran is still a very vibrant, youthful very modern society right now as we speak.
I think. I think that's really beautifully said. And to add to that and to answer your que question Kara about women that who had it all and then now it's totally different. I think for people who, and I have family who lived in Iran before the revolution when they were wearing, they show me pictures of, and we've all seen them online, of women wearing crop tops and short shorts expressing themselves even more freely than I ever have here.
And as a real estate advisor, I guide people through making choices for about their home. And whether that's walls and a roof or your body having the choice is everything as a woman, just as a human being for everyone, for all of us. And to have that choice taken away even if you came here before, I have family members who came here before the revolution.
It's heartbreaking to think that their home is gone. It no longer exists. The home that they grew up in, their motherland is totally different. It's turned upside down. So the women and the girls who have more courage in their pinky finger than their impress, than their oppressors have in their whole body, who, like Marjan mentioned are saying basically they have nothing to lose.
So they're saying Enough is enough. And they are, these women and girls are healing so many people around the world including men and boys. Like Mar also mentioned men are oppressed too. And I think that. This isn't just in, in Iran now, it's, we see it in a lot of other cultures too. The machismo concept and in different industries and organizations all around the world.
This affects all of us. When men are conditioned to be cut off from a really important, beautiful part of themselves, their own inner femininity, it creates this like this, I think shame that they project onto women and girls who they rape and beat to death. And men and boys are hurting too, and it's it affects everyone.
Danny, how is this all showing up in Australia and is it very in aligned with what we're seeing experiencing here based on what we've shared in the us? Yeah, look, absolutely. And because I'm just getting so many messages a lot of the people in Iran are actually using their VPN, so I have one message here where she share, she shares Dani.
My English is not very good, but I can tell you this, we die every day in this country, Danny, every day, somewhere in every part of my country, someone dies just for this natural desire to have freedom and no one can do anything about it. Every day with a bad memory of yesterday, we wake up, but we hope for good days.
Before, maybe my hope was low, but now Danny, because of you and people like you, I feel good. My hope has increased and my courage has increased. So what we were just talking about before, we're actually the people that are being, the voice for the people of Iran are just giving them that hope. And they have got so much courage.
And to me, like Sarah was saying before, they're such an inspiration. They are oh, like they've got nothing to lose. And that's why I'm standing beside them all because we don't, we have nothing to lose. People are dying every day. Yeah, I, we echo the, everything that's been discussed today here in Australia as well.
I don't think I can ever imagine at this point in my life, the degree of courage that those young women in particular are choosing to step into. There's the level of privilege you mentioned before, Sarah of the things that we are worried about in different parts of the world is. It, embarrassing in the scope of what they have to wake up to and not know what is or isn't gonna happen and to choose to do it anyway.
Like I, how can the rest of us tap into that, as Danny mentioned, to help like echo that forward because yeah I'm like, what can I do? I'll just give you more, how do we put more fuel into what you guys need? I'm always gonna jump in if Please do. I think what's very important is Danny, I, you make me very emotional.
Just on off of that, I feel like it's it's something else. When they know their lives are at risk and they go out there and fight for. The values that they believe they're, they are inherently owed. And they are, they're god-given rights, right to freedom of expression, right to life, to be free of life, to live a life where it's, where life is dignified. There's no torture imprisonment for expressing who you are, not just in as an individual, but your ideology. And I think what's incredible, and I've said this over and over again, is that this movement is relatable because it far extends the borders of Iran.
This is not just something that women in Iran have suffered from, but it is, as I said, all inclusive in that it includes different social classes despite the polarized society where we, in which I guess all around the world, but mainly in Iran, 1% of the population hold most of the wealth, 90% of the wealth, they have the power.
Unfortunately, we're dealing with a government where people have been put in positions of power, not based on merit, because of nepotism, because of connection. And this is a huge thing that people need to understand about the structures of this government that we're talking about. It is systemically put in place, put together in order to oppress and control.
It's not the kind of government where we, yes. Sharia Law as Marja VA, put perfectly, there is Sharia Law and there's interpretations of it, which are extreme. And as the other lady Marjan said, we're not fighting Islam. We're fighting the odd ideology that is extreme in its nature. It's oppress, it's meant to divide.
It's not meant to unite, it's meant to put certain people in power and then have them abuse power against the other sector of the society. And I think, just going back to your question, it is very important to understand that as an, as a structure, they don't they might necessarily not believe as MS put that they're allowed to rape people or they're out to torture people That, but.
According to a certain interpretation of Islam, which is called Haddi, where these imams come and interpret it the way they want, whichever way they please, that is true in practice. Thankfully it has not happened as much in Iran. But yes, the fact that there is this notion that is even possible gives us chills.
It's like unbearable to even think. And just going back to your question, I think being informed his, of the history of Iran, of what it's going through now, of this economic stagnation of the inflation. People come outta university with higher degrees, not able to get a job. They become taxi drivers. They work in butcher shops or supermarkets.
That's unbel for a young person. Now living in Iran, the future that like as Danny was as we was talking about dying every day. Dying every day doesn't mean literally just literally getting bullets into your chest, which they unfortunately are like subjected to. It means not having a future, not being able to dream of a future where you can feed your family, educate your children, be part of society.
These young people are on a riot. Protesting the ability not to be part of their country's future. In every other country, youth are invited to come in and vote to be part of the movement to express their descent In our country, they're receiving bullets, being beaten, imprisoned. I'm talking about geniuses, I'm talking about people who are any other country, any other university, any other, would accept them with open arms with a red carpet underneath them, asking them to fly us to the moon.
It is absolutely excruciatingly painful to say, see that, but I think information is absolutely key, knowing how to help, because they don't come from a necessarily privilege. They're not about expression, body autonomy necessarily in a sense that we know of in the West. And that is different.
Do you think that there is. Extra attention from the US in particular and Australia. I think as well, going through similar things right now of seeing what we thought were more guaranteed democracies in existence, being challenged right now where we hear echoes of what's happening in Iran and how close it is for any country to shift between what we think is stability to what we think is not.
And how are other, current political global shifts impacting the fact that everyone's listening at a higher level to Iran right now?
First of all, the Iranian women are leading their charge. They are making their voices loud enough that you are almost forced to say something about it or represent them. For instance, one of the taglines of this protest is be our voice. Why is that? Because immediately when the protest started and by the way, this is Mar Jean Chy.
I don't know that. Why the camera's not me. That's okay. So for anyone listening why is that? Because the moment the protest started, we cut the internet, we cut the mobile lines, right? So now people have to skirt their way, get VPNs. I just said, the poorest areas don't have service. They're getting like few clips out.
And I have had people send me videos and I will tell you like, okay, I send a few seconds. I can't send more. They'll see me taking videos. No, no other place in the world have you seen protests. And then people go, Hey, be your voice. Share this. Please don't let them forget about us. So I have to send messages like, we have not forget, forgotten about you.
They don't want to ask other countries for help. But what would you do if, I'm sorry to say it so bluntly, but if the enemy was your government. What would you do? The very least we can do is share their stories. The very least we can do very least is make a statement. Even if we don't give money, even we don't change the laws.
It's shocking to me that some major institutions, universities, after we saw that Sharif University students were taking hostage, have not come out and made a statement that some of the major political leaders, now I now give much gratitude to those who have, we have seen leaders in Europe, south America Australia, come, Canada come out.
The conservative party in Canada is deploring what the government is doing, showing their support, cutting their hair, politicians and other countries cutting their hair. How beautiful. The Iranian people are just asking to be our voice and they're saying, you know what? We can do this even if you don't wanna help us, just do not hurt us.
To piggyback off of what Mary John said, it's so funny saying your name 'cause I have the same name. But I think one thing that's really impactful is the age of social media. Because before perhaps there wasn't such a platform to share about exactly what's going on when it's going on.
And I say that because that's what instigated the whole movement, which was I think three weeks ago when Masa Amini was taken by the Morality police. I find that so funny. Because it's like, what even is that if you're gonna kill somebody for what they're, how they're dressed for having a piece of hair sticking out, which by the way is in no way in alignment with any religion that I know of.
So I think that. A lot of these officials and a lot of these officers have taken, not even necessarily their interpretation, but taken what, taken advantage of what they can with their religion and turned it into, this is now my justification for inflicting harm on another person. And it just like begs the question of like, where is your consciousness in all this?
Like where do you land on morality, as you'd say in all this? And so back to the massive thing, they projected this for the world to see that this girl was taken and she was beaten primarily. I think she died from like blunt force trauma to her head. And they labeled it as a heart attack, which is it's gosh, if you can't even have be dignified in life, like at least have some, at least per.
Perceive or at least impart some dignity in their death, which is also the same thing that happened to two of the other Girls Haw Academy and then Sarina, I think, or Es same thing. Like they were badly beaten to death. But what's and the mother of Show Academy came out yesterday or the day before and made a statement about, okay, here's what they want me to say and here's what I'm actually saying.
And so I think what's so powerful is that now with social media, it's created this, okay, we're going to spread this awareness everywhere so that those officials can't actually take the steps that they would ordinarily be able to take. And people aren't just going to sit there and give your rendition of the story.
They're not just gonna say, my daughter died of a heart attack. No, my daughter died of blunt force trauma after she was repeatedly beat and raped and then, finally killed. So I think that. That's one good thing. That's one good thing that we have here as a resource for ourselves that we can spread awareness.
But what's so heartbreaking for a lot of us, I think, is that I was sharing with some of the ladies in this group that I feel so strangely connected to the people in Iran right now, especially the women. I feel like it's in my DNA and I have absolutely no idea what they're going through. And I can't even say that I do.
'cause I'm sitting here on my end of the world with all my privilege, not having ever experienced, tinner mining experiences, minor experiences when I've gone to Iran, I've had people on the streets like, tell me to correct my veil or to, I think they can tell when you're a foreigner just by the way you walk and talk, et cetera.
And it's been like, I remember my mom's just don't let it, don't let it bother you. But it got on my nerves. I was like, what is it to this person? And she's a woman. She's a woman. And she's telling me that I have to dress a certain way and I'm sitting here are you kidding me?
And but really I think I can only appreciate like a tiny little percentage of what these girls are going through. And it's hard for me to, in a way, like I'm not the one jumping in front of bullets. So I think that's another thing to keep in mind is I can sit here and go, Hey, women in Iran, you're doing great things.
But I'm really, I'm sitting on my end of the world with all my privilege. And I have absolutely no idea what they're really, truly going through. And I'm, my hope, and I think through this talk and through raising the awareness, is that enough of this is projected to the world. Enough of this is brought to light to where.
Something actually shifts in Iran for the better. And who knows, like maybe a woman will come to power. That's what I'd like to see is a woman comes to power. And for kind of all of this stuff that's been happening and looming in the background to quiet down and for people to be able to just live their life and have the basic rights that they should be afforded and to be able to reap the benefits of a very wealthy country.
'cause Iran is a very wealthy country with a lot of resources and there's enough wealth to go around and unfortunately that's not currently what's happening. Do you think that now is when leadership in Iran will shift, how close are we to it actually shifting?
Just a couple of notes because the ladies pointed out two things that were very important, I think for everyone to, to know in that put it beautifully. It's so wonderful to see how the social movement network movement has helped this civil movement, this sort of civil disobedience. And we have made diff a difference, like you, just to your question, we have already made a difference.
We've united, we've we're about to organize, we are now informed, and more importantly, inside Iran, my father was saying how, and they've gone around and women already have taken their scarves off with police officers across them actually protecting them. So this in a sense, might not be enough for US observers from the outside, but I think every little count and every move towards that.
Ideal freedom, whatever that is, is very important to understand. But I also just please let me know if I'm jumping ahead. I just, regarding social network, I just internet, we were talking about Mar was. Pointing out the blockage of internet, something we, they call digital authoritarianism.
It's something a lot of dictatorships use because they know it's a very effective tool for the population, especially the young to collaborate, to organize and form each other of what's going on. There's no longer this dark room and you can commit atrocities without the world knowing you'll have to pay for your sins.
And I think shedding that spotlight has been incredible. Celebrities like Justin Bald UA Lipa today many, all the French ladies that I can go on, I'm such an admirer of French cinema. So that's, that just has been like my, the highlights for me in a lot of ways have joined in set. Every little count, every platform is important.
Every one of us have the chance to make a difference because people listen. And when people listen when minds change, leaders can no longer ignore us. That's where the transformative nature of the movement kicks in. But what's very important, and I wanna quickly point out, is what used to happen in years in terms of civil disobedience or movement in seven years, eight years, 10 years?
Harvey Milk, Martin Luther King, it used to be planned organized, had the leadership, had members join in, and there was a lot of substance and foundation built around it. Now, today, we can gather thousands of people by submitting, like putting posters on social media and people will come and there will be a huge population who will show up.
But we don't have a purpose after that. We don't have a mission to follow. We don't have a substance to, we don't have a program. And I think we need to be aware of what social media gives us. But what it lacks, and that is substance, that is a foundation that we can work off of to something else because great, all well and wonderful for people to come out amazingly effective.
But what happens after that is important. We have people sign petitions, but do you know what you're actually signing? Do you know what, where that is gonna go? Do you know what's gonna happen after that? Because we're here in West where we're talking about privilege. We're in a position of privilege because we feel that signing something or being part of the marches relieves us from our civil duties.
We have done it. We've done this podcast, we've talked, it's over. No, it's not. It's just the beginning. It's the first step. And that leads me directly to what would success look like? What are the core asks that when will we know that we've achieved? One step forward or all the steps forward that everyone's looking for?
What are those asks that everyone's making, please? Marja. Kara, that's Kara. I don't know why the camera's not on me, but I'll be quick. It's a complicated answer to be honest with you. A lot of the Iran people are wanna talk about right now. They say we will get there. I believe we are in the middle of a revolution.
They don't even like to call it that. These are just protests. They are protesting every day. They have been protesting every day for 22 days. Currently, right now, today there are over 200 protests. In cities around the world outside of Iran. Last week there was over 150. So this is growing. People are noticing we are in the middle of a revolution.
And the revolution takes time. It takes over a year where the infrastructure goes down. We will see what will be put in its place. It will be much closer in regards to female equality. I believe at this time, now that it's 2022, by the time new laws are acted, it'll be 20 23, 20 24, that it will likely be 50 50.
But that is really a prediction. This is just gonna take time. And they don't even wanna discuss that. They say, can we please take these people down?
Yeah, and I think it's really important to note as well on the dwindling avenues or for political pushback, or that there is really no hope for reform right now, which is fueling this mass mobilization people are at a point of desperation that we've never seen before. In the green movement. There was, brought in an already established political figure to spearhead that in hopes that maybe if we can get someone in office.
With policy that is a little bit less oppressive, but right now this is a leaderless movement. This is the first time we're seeing a movement that is by the people, for the people to really capitalize on that. And I think what Pega was touching on earlier with this widespread traumatization that is happening, healing also has this sort of canopy effect.
So if we can continue in these conversations, if we can make these women feel heard and feel noted, we can also create a sort of positive feedback loop of inspiring others and keeping this conversation going, and really recognizing their level of desperation to, to keep dismantling the forces that be and look at later steps once we've done.
What is it that is giving you guys equally the most frustration and equally the most hope right now?
I think we can all answer that one by one, that I would love to hear everyone. Yeah, go ahead Pega. No, you go ahead. It's okay. I'll go after you. Okay. The thing that gives me the most frustration is that given the size of what is going on, that they are not only the regime is still trying to recruit their army, recruit so many different aspects of their military and government, which half the people don't even want to be participating in, but.
That frustrates me that they are not not, they haven't all left the country. That is usually what happens at the beginning of the revolution. All of their children have left the country. It also frustrates me that a lot of the western countries have not spoken out against it. A lot of leaders or are speaking out very late.
But what encourages me is the 13-year-old girls. The 12-year-old girls. I don't know that having grown up in America, I ha would've had the will to do that, but they are probably frustrated from such a young age. They don't want to become, someone who's married at 15 or 16. They want to be educated.
The fact that I'm seeing these little girls protest, take off their hijab, push out their school administrator, I think that has given e everybody hope. Can you imagine? Can you imagine your. 13-year-old is going out to protest your 12-year-old girl. How would you feel as a mother? But even the mothers aren't telling all of the, are telling their kids to stay home 'cause they also want a better future for their kids.
Go ahead. Yeah. So what frustrates me is that change isn't happening right now. I think we all want it. We're we've had enough. But we have to remember, I think it's important to remember it took, what, 40 plus years to get here and it's gonna take time. And so we have to really prepare ourselves, like Sarah mentioned, like how can we help in concrete ways, like compassion fatigue is a real thing.
We're all like energized now, but over time people are gonna forget or get busy with their day-to-day lives. And we really have to have programs. I don't know, I don't have the solutions, but we really need to carve out time to continue this conversation at the very least and try to find solutions and know that it'll take time.
And to be patient with one another. And what gives me hope is that what's different, I think this time than back in the late seventies. During the revolution back then was women, people protested back then too, but there wasn't eyes on them like there is now thanks to social media, thanks to the internet.
I think that a big part of it is, yes, women and girls are saying, we have nothing to lose. Enough is enough. And the men and boys who support them too and they know that the world is watching and they're hopeful that, we'll be their voice as Mar mentioned, the other marriage I mentioned.
And yeah, I feel like we as human beings, we have a duty to be their voice, and this gives me so much hope because by healing others, we heal ourselves. Thank you, harissa.
Sure. Just to even piggyback off of that as well by healing them, we do heal ourselves. We even see based on in my own field in psychotherapy, we see how trauma is embedded within our DNA within our genetics. Whenever our families, whenever our predecessors go through such massive political trauma, it embeds itself in how we then respond just out of sheer survival.
And so by participating in these conversations, by elevating their voices, we're healing our own lineages as well. So I really, if I can get any message out today, it would be if you have ever experienced oppression within your family, if you are an immigrant, a first generation, second generation, or have friends who are immigrants or have any kind of experience with.
With what it is to feel so helpless. Then the sheer act of participating in these conversations and staying informed in cultivating spaces for compassionate conversation and dialogue, you are healing yourself and those around you. It is so critical to do and I think that by creating that space as well and by really inviting our Western counterparts to engage in conversation and curiosity, that's the best thing we can do to upkeep this momentum.
I read a 16-year-old girl, say earlier today, president Biden, the smell of oil is so thick, it masks the smell of our blood. And so if we can continue to place the spotlight on things that matter and really pressure our government to really supersede their own political interests, we can make massive change.
Thank you. Danny, how about you? Yeah, look, same here. The frustration obviously with what all the ladies were saying, but also inspired by the female students. Just recently when they had the president come to their universities, they were chanting, get lost at the Iranian president.
So just for them to actually just speak those words to, this regime, I'm just I'm so excited that they have that voice. I've just recently embarked in the fashion industry, so I'm a little bit excited that the big brands like Gucci and Bales, I can't even pronounce their names.
And even the likes of the Kim Kardashians of the world sharing this message and they've got a pretty large audience. So I'm excited about that. Marjan. So I have two big frustrations, actually. One of them more of a heartbreak. I'm heartbroken and I. Anyone with a heart is also can empathize in seeing like these really young girls dying for absolutely no reason at the hands of really.
Barbaric methods of ending someone's life. That's really heartbreaking. It's hard to watch. I've had to like, take breaks from social media because it's just it's too much to bear in a way. And again, I have no real appreciation for what their families are facing. The other frustration I have is I wanna be able to take my white husband to Iran.
And show him how beautiful of a country it is. It is so beautiful. And the last time I was there, I got to enjoy all the amazing food and go to all the beautiful places. And we have, Kara, you've been in our family parties. Our culture is so rich with love and warmth and food and dancing.
And that's just, that's exactly what all the people in Iran want to be able to express to the fullest degree. And I feel frustrated that more people don't know this is what Iran actually looks like. It's not this like desert that with people, prancing around on camels, like it's, doesn't look like that.
It's actually a really beautiful country. And I've gotten to venture to a lot of the different places and I'm telling my husband, oh, I just wanna take you to Eson and I wanna take you to Persepolis and Shira, and there's these castles that I want to take you to see, and I wanna take my kids there one day.
And so my frustration. In that, and so much of my family, I have 45 first cousins and they're all in Iran. Pretty much. I have some family interspersed over the US. The vast majority are back home. And then what gives me hope are like the Dan's of the world are, are the HEROs of the world, the Amandas of the world, the Annas of the world.
And all my, obviously brothers and sisters that are also Persian, but just everyone that's not and is so passionate about what's going on and wants to expedite the process as Pago was saying. Let's get, let's do this, let's get it done. Come on. But also just I want to inform the world.
And Danny, like she mentioned, she has a big platform and she's sharing about it all the time. It's in her bio is it's like the colors of the Iranian flag. And Sarah does too. And like Balenciaga, Gucci, like all these real, and Hozier actually heard about that girl sorry, now who sang his song and he was really deeply saddened by it.
And so that gives me so much hope because I'm like, oh my God, people are actually listening to what's happening there. And I feel like that's really what's gonna propagate the change. Thank you, Sarah.
To be honest with you, I'm not sure if frustration is the word, because having dedicated seven years of my life to human rights, I've. I think gathered an insignificant amount of knowledge about the politics of the world and how human rights works in general, sadly, but I want to be optimistic about its future, but just off of the politics of the world I literally had this speech prepared saying, dear Mr.
President, and that's how it began. It was my letter. I was like, I don't know if you can hear me, but this and this and that. I not only I couldn't vote, but I did calls, I gathered values. I explained to people that it is about voting for someone who stands by ideals and values that you believe in, regardless of what the politics, their international politics is about.
Because ultimately, America, France, all the big shots, they will always prioritize their national interests over other countries. This is a fact. So now that we're talking about nuclear, it's just a facade to basically, or we're talking about a lot of other things as I think Pega and Mar put.
It is about oil. It. And I think now Choky said it's about the oil stupid. It's about the oil. And this was long before this had started. And now with the current state of Russia and the fact that gas is missing and they need that, and even I had never thought that it would be hard for Mr.
Truder to say that this, these, this regime, this, these, the SEPA is a terrorist for all means and purposes. But he did. And that just goes to show, or the fact that President Biden, or Ms. Kamala Harris, who stands by the ideals of women's rights is in a lot of ways holds the torch. The beacon of hope for women around the world has barely mentioned and has maintained a very neutral stance.
That does hurt me. It doesn't frustrate me. It makes me think about what I need to do. And if I were to just put. Just outta the top of my head, the four bullet points is that we need to one unite, we need to put our ideas about what it should be. How do you say, what we abide by the ideologies, the schools of thoughts aside, and think about the main interests of the society.
That's number one. Two is nu organization planning, because we're missing the, how do you say, the traditional structures of activism. Now We need to find ways to understand what the society needs, how it gets information, how it's informed, how it's mobilized. We need, I was talking to my friends, I said, we need one source to get the information from.
We need just an Instagram page to know how the protests, when the protests are happening. Who can offer what. And then for these organizations, be it not an NGO or just a separate organization, people then, like Pega can offer their real estate advice and be like, this is what we can do in this. Or whatever.
Or Danny can say, I ga I'll gather and donations from the fashion industry, then what have you and what have you. And I, Paris had just pointed out something very incredible. And that is what we, a lot of us immigrants experience. And that is the guilt, the survival, guilt, survivor's guilt.
And we need to be able to channel that frustration and that anger and that sadness into something that is useful. Remind ourselves that we're in a position of privilege. Okay, what can we do? We can de I can definitely what I always. Tell a lot of my friends, I said, I cannot ask people to go risk their lives outside when time comes, when I can offer them reciprocally the same amount in value as someone's life, then I can ask them to go out there and risk their lives.
Until then, I need to find strategic, practical, organized, hopefully with leadership, and as Maran put it out, that comes slowly into a movement that is effective for people inside, which we go back to being of service for people that are at the front lines of this. I echo so much of what all of you have shared and when I started an organization called Powerful Ladies, I did not realize that.
It was ultimately a human rights organization that was accidentally being created. And I think what has, what I've been illuminated to is how disappointed I am in people who speak ideals and then never echo it, never do it, never take the actions. And I think there are so many people we've had hope in who just aren't walking the walk.
And so I wanna keep having conversations with women like all of you who are saying, I'll do it. I'll stand up, I'll hold your hands. And I think that's so much of the power of what we have an option to do. And where Powerful Ladies came from was just wanting to remind each other that you're not alone.
And I think that really ties back into what you've all shared about the most powerful thing that we can do right now today for the women of Iran is to keep telling them, you're not alone. We see you. We hear you. We're holding hands symbolically with you and don't ever think that you are by yourself because you're not.
So it, I just wanna quickly say, I was just gonna say, Amanda, it's not just like a trend for a 24 hour campaign that we're doing either. So this is my fourth week and I'm posting every single day. And even though my work and brands may not like me posting while I've got a certain outfit or what have you, they're still actually supporting me as well because I said, how can I possibly work when there are women and children and men dying?
This is not part of humanity. I can't pretend, hi everyone, I'm just, wearing this amazing outfit, but my, friends in Iran are just dying. Or as Sarah was saying, even just the hope of just their life, they're just slowly dying because everything's been taken and stripped off them.
So that's one thing that I'm just really passionate about, is just continue every day, even if it's just one little post. Just make sure that we're their voices every day. Yeah. Amazing. And thank you. One thing that we are committed to with these powerful conversations is that they're not a one-time scenario.
And so I will be inviting all of you back and we'll figure out what the frequency makes sense. If it's six months from now, if it's four months we'll figure out what that looks like because we don't want this to be a one and done conversation at all. I'm gonna let all of you give a final share to everyone listening to final expression of what you wanna make sure people know, actions to take how you want to be of service with each other.
I'm gonna start again with Marjan as she was such an instigator and making sure this all came together. So thank you, Marjan. Thank you for having me. It's been such a joy. It's been a joy to hear from all these other amazing ladies from different backgrounds. I think the question was, how, what was the question?
Cara? Say it again. It was a final wrap up statement. What you wanna say. Okay. You would make sure we know, all the things. I think definitely one of the biggest things is just stay involved. Don't let the fire die out. And I'm saying that to myself too. Don't go back to the way things were.
This is the time, especially now, that people are getting tired in Iran. And they need support, they need additional support. So keep the conversation going, like you said. Share as much as you can. Learn as much as you can and link arms with anyone you know in any way you can.
People are taking donations right now in Iran, so if that's something that compels you forward, then please, take that step. People are nominating share song for a Grammy, please. For, I think it's the Grammy for the best song for social change. Please nominate him 'cause I think he's absolutely deserving of that.
And just stay informed, learn the history and feel free to connect to any one of us. I'd love to have more conversations and make more friends and connections in this arena. Beautiful. Thank you Marjon. Great. I just wanna echo what the women of Iran are asking, which is to not forget about them to be their voice.
Please, repost, reshare if you feel awkward about it. If your page is not political, guess nobody's page is political. Up until now, this is about human rights. This is about women's rights, it's about doing. The right thing. Over 80% of the population of Iran is Gen Z. There's just a few old people on the, in the top who's trying to hold on to power.
They will get toppled down. You will, you may get exhausted seeing the stories and may be hard to see the photos. Just imagine living it. Please repost if you can. And if you don't have the time to go to the protest or you don't feel comfortable donating you can do one repost. You can sign an Amnesty International, pledge.
They just require your email and, and your first name. If you get emails from them, you can unsubscribe, but just, signing your name, it's so quick. You can do it in under 30 seconds. Perfect. Thank you Parisa. Yeah. So I think really digging deep within ourselves and finding ways that we can engage in a sustainable way.
I think someone mentioned earlier compassion fatigue and how real that is. And digging deep within your own personal and professional networks. If you're a writer, write blog posts. If you're an artist, create protest signage. If you're an educator, carve out five minutes for your students to be able to air out what they know and what they'd like to know.
Just finding ways that make sense for you and your immediate community to think globally, but act locally so that we can sustain this conversation and we can keep the momentum going. Beautiful. Thank you Pega. Yeah. When Maja asked me to join this conversation, it was an immediate last yes. Literally anything she asked me.
I don't think I've ever said no. Like it's always a yes because, maja has this wonderful way of being real. And when I, as a recovering perfectionist, when I wanna fall back into my old patterns of wanting everything to be rainbows and butterflies and unicorns Marja helps me keep it real. And I think it's really hard when you're proud.
A lot of cultures like ours are, we're very proud people. Reliance hard of a lion. At the same time, like Danny said, oh my gosh, Danny, like your outer beauty is just a reflection of your inner beauty. You saying like, how can I work when it's just, it like really? It's just the fact that you're sharing daily, you don't have to do that.
And you're, the fact that you're doing that is just so beautiful. And I think that you're an example of the fact that we all know what we need to do the root cause of why we don't do it. I don't know. Maybe it's because I'll share from my experiences, like maybe being too proud. And just like we do spring cleaning of our home, it has to get, a little messy before it gets better.
And and that's okay. And Sarah, you mentioned that I brought up oil, actually it wasn't me. I can't take up credit for that. It was parisa and it was I wrote this down. The smell of oil is so strong, it masks the smell of our blood. Yes. Is that how you said it? Parisa Oh my gosh. Yeah, I think the next time someone tries to talk about religion being the problem or a slew of other reasons, those are all distractions.
It's okay for us to call bullshit and on, on all these distractions and stay focused on what this really is about. It's a country of, valuable resources and and people are paying for it with their blood and it's not right. So we all know the right thing to do and we're doing it.
And I thank you all. Thank you, Danny. I think I've said enough because I'm sharing every day. But yeah, that's just my message to my community. And, I just hope even if they've just got one follower or 10 million, that it just ricochets and we just spread this blanket of peace worldwide and that we can connect regularly and that we can reshare our posts as well.
And yeah, it's really important to just stay connected every day. Thank you so much. And Sarah God, I, even, the closing argument could go on and on, so I'll just briefly say I agree with so many of the ladies that pointed out local activism. Be it making a poster or signing a petition. However, I also want people to know that there is this notion that leaders are the real change makers, and that is not necessarily true.
Even though yes, alliances matter, brokering relationships with them, creating a table where we can all sit and discuss. In an ideal world, absolutely yes. But I think what's even more important, and also just regarding the petition naty, what I want everyone to understand is that international law is a system based on agreement of states.
So it's not binding and they don't have executive power. It's very important for people to know that because we think that once we do that, we can just put it off and the wind will carry it wherever it may be, and everything will be jolly and fine. Unfortunately, it's not, and we've seen that with Syria.
The General Assembly created a mechanism, an investigative mechanism, and for five years now, nothing has happened because the states are abusing the power are the very states that block us from entering and do the, doing those investigations. So we need to do more than that, and that is putting people at the top under so much pressure that they cannot ever ignore us.
Now, Danny put says it beautifully, we need to keep the momentum going. We need to keep posting, informing, putting it out there. Yes, absolutely. But just going for further than that, regarding the movement and the revolutionary we're talking about right now, in this day, age, and this is factual, this is a Harvard study.
Movements are not about the size. It's about the skill of the organization, of that movement. And that is very important to know. And I wanna add to that durability. The dur, if this goes on it is not, as we were talking about a very young population, it's bound to change anyway. It's not a matter of if, but a matter of when.
We want to make sure less people are under threat, vulnerable to brutality and violence, and worse yet lose their lives. And also we want to make sure that those lives were not lost in vain and that this will come to fruition to and we will forever honor their memories, sadly. But with all our, with everything we have, we will go, I have no doubt that we will get Iran back.
I will no doubt that through this movement, many non Iranians have become Iranian, have joined us, and we're fuck. I'm sorry, for lack of a better word, wonderful about it, is that now Iran is now this symbol of justice and freedom and we've all this is something everyone can unite behind and we can observe it in Australia, we can see it in France.
We can, and as everyone put out beautifully, it's not about against being against Muslims, being against Islam, it's being against Islamism extremism where we're controlled, not given rights.
Thank you so much. I, IQ it's such an honor to, and I am continually humbled by. Who says yes and who is on board to share and share your perspectives and to be a voice for those who are voiceless. I'm humbled that you guys were a yes to be here today and to take time out of your day and everything else you have going on to be here.
I know that all of powerful ladies and all of the powerful humans and men that are alongside with us. We have so much going on, and the decision fatigue is real. The distraction fatigue is real. And it is so important to keep talking about this and talking about everything else that we want to see change.
And it gives me the ability to sleep at night knowing that the entire burden is not on my own shoulders, but we're all sharing it to some extent. So thank you for sharing this. Thank you for being powerful ladies. I cannot wait to continue this conversation. And as always I am here to continue to be a connector and a collaborator.
So please make bold requests of myself and everyone else here and those who are part of powerful ladies. Thank you guys so much for your time today. Yeah, thank you, Kai. Thank you. Thank you guys. Everybody, you're an inspiration. Yes. Thank you guys so much. So for all the panelists, what's next is this will be coming out as our live episode this Wednesday for the podcast.
All of the things to share it will be sent with you guys. But please, everyone who's listening, tell your friends to share the episode, to pass it along, to use it as a tool for more information. We will continue to be sharing in our platform, power Pro Ladies and my own everything we're able to gather from these women and everything else that is happening.
But go be amazing. You guys are incredible and we will keep changing the world. Thank you guys. Thank you. Thank you for having me. See. Of course. My pleasure. I'll be stalking all you all on. Yeah. Yes, please do. Sorry. Sorry, ladies. Bye. No, bye. Thank you.
All the links that connect with our amazing panelists are in our show notes@thepowerfulladies.com. Please subscribe to this podcast wherever you're listening and share this episode with those who should hear it. Come join us on Instagram at Powerful Ladies, and if you're looking to connect directly with me, visit kara duffy.com or Kara Duffy on Instagram.
I'll be back next week with a brand new episode. Until then, I we're taking on being powerful in your life. Go be awesome and up to something you love.
Related Episodes
Episode 173: A Powerful Conversation Series - Racism: Has Anything Changed?
Episode 165: A Powerful Conversation Series - Conscious Entrepreneurship & Environmentalism
Episode 196: The Revolution She Couldn’t Stay Silent About | Sara Seyed | Iranian Actor & Human Rights Advocate
Dr. Marjan Koosha Johnson - @thedancing.doctor
Dr. Marjon Vatanchi - @dr.marjon
Pegah Ghamary - @Lajollapegah
Sara Seyed - @saraseyed
Parisa Frost - @frost.talk
Dani Stevens - @danistevens
Here are actions you can take to support women of Iran:
Be their voice - The internet crackdowns have robbed Iranians of their voice, which means they need us to be their voice. Let's talk about it. Ask questions and educate yourself. Don't be afraid to speak up or participate in this movement.
Share on all social media platforms - Use social media to share information and posts of protests from Iran and around the world. Search social media by using the hashtags #mahsaamini, #iranprotests, #iranprotest2022, and #zhinaamini.
Attend a Protest near you - Now is the time to organize, rally, and show support by attending a protest in or near your city. Whether you are simply driving by the protest and honking your horn in solidarity, or you are designing you own poster and chanting with them.
Sign this petition - Amnesty International has created a petition to end the bloodshed currently taking place in Iran. This petition is a call for states to "set up an independent UN mechanism now to investigate and ensure accountability for the most serious crimes under international law in Iran." You can sign the petition here.
Created and hosted by Kara Duffy
Audio Engineering & Editing by Jordan Duffy
Production by Amanda Kass
Graphic design by Anna Olinova
Music by Joakim Karud
