Episode 7: Building a Life You Love in Business and at Home | Marhnelle & David Hibbard | Founders of Dialexis

Marhnelle and David Hibbard are the kind of couple who prove you really can have it all: a thriving business, a strong marriage, and a life built around purpose. As co-founders of Dialexis, they’ve spent decades coaching leaders and sales teams at companies like Apple, Xerox, and DuPont, helping them achieve breakthrough results. They’ve also co-authored bestselling books, traveled the world as speakers, and somehow managed to keep their personal life just as strong as their professional one. In this conversation, we talk about risk-taking, staying true to your vision, and how to “get clear” on what’s next. You’ll hear how they’ve navigated challenges, supported each other through growth, and built a life far beyond what either imagined.

“She fulfilled a dream and that’s when you said, show up, stand up, take that risk, go to the skinny edge of the branch and just believe what you want to happen cause that to me is our power. That to me is your personal power. That’s when it gets juicy.”

— Marhnelle HIbbard

• Show Notes

  Gratitude List
  Affirmation Book
  White Paper
  “When I Get Clear It Happens”
  Wizard of Oz
  Transformational Workshop
  Australia
  Dupont
  Leadership Training
  Credentials
  Masters
  Harvard
  “Getting Clear” - gaining clarity on what you’re next move, purpose, or goal should be as a result of removing unproductive distractions and/or allowing yourself to marinate on it.
  Declaration
  “Cleaning Something Up” - to get complete or flat with someone to whom you’ve had a negative impact upon or to whom you didn’t keep you word.  It’s to leave someone whole or back to neutral without necessarily apologizing. Taking the morality out of a situation while also removing any upset.
  Mother’s Day
  Mercedes
  Commercial Real Estate
  “Looking Good” - being worried about how you appear to others in looks, behavior, positioning, etc vs being authentic or other priorities.
  Christmas
  “Maximizing You”
  Lion King
  “20 Ways for Free Right Now to Claim Some Power”
  Right way to shake hands
  Chicago
  Self Talk
  “The Power of Negative People”
  Movie Studio
  “Get Shiny” article
  “Empty Suit”
  Corporate Collateral - your career experience. Similar to financial collateral, but related to your job experience. It’s what makes you a desirable hire.
  Mosque
  Muslim
  Dr. Iziki
  Jim Carrey

• Transcript

  Follow along using the Transcript

  Chapters:

  00:00 Meeting Marhnelle & David Hibbard

  01:30 The origin of Dialexis

  03:10 Lessons from decades in sales leadership

  05:45 What it means to “get clear”

  08:15 Taking risks and stepping onto the skinny branch

  10:40 How to lead with courage

  13:05 Balancing business growth and personal life

  15:20 The Canoe Theory and building strong teams

  18:10 Letting go of distractions to reach your goals

  21:30 How to keep learning and evolving together

  24:15 The role of mentors in their journey

  27:00 Selling their business and planning the next chapter

  29:30 Advice for women stepping into leadership

  32:15 Creating a legacy in work and life

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  She fulfilled a dream and that's when you said, show up, stand up, take that risk.

  Go to the skinny edge of that branch and just believe that you really want to happen, because that to me is our power. That to me is your personal power. With that, that's when it gets juicy.

  That's Marhnelle Hibbard and this is The Powerful Ladies Podcast.

  Hey guys, I'm your host, Kara Duffy, and this is The Powerful Ladies Podcast where I invite my favorite humans, the awesome, the up to something, and the extraordinary to come and share their story. These are people that inspire me and remind me that everything is possible. I hope that you will be left entertained, inspired, and moved to take action towards living your most powerful life.

  If you look up Power Couple, the first example is Beyonce and Jay-Z. The second example is Dave and Marhnelle Hibbard. They're the co-founders of Dialects, a sales training mindset and leadership coaching business, as well as public speakers and co-authors of two books. The First Source Selling How to Get Through to Almost Anyone, the proven method for reaching decision makers.

  And the Second, the Canoe Theory, a business success strategy for leaders and associates. For decades, they have been traveling the world, coaching executives on leadership and sales teams on achieving breakthroughs for pretty much every major company in the world, including Apple, Xerox, and DuPont. As successful as their business has been, they also are an example of what it looks like to win at home.

  I'm so inspired by the respect they have for each other, how they've grown and evolved together, and how they really do push balance and elevate each other. I was lucky to meet them when Marhnelle took a personal development program for which I was a coach. Ever since. I've been looking to her and Dave for inspiration advice and as a reminder that you can create a life beyond your wildest expectations, even from nothing on this episode.

  I was lucky to get them both in the studio and have them share their journey as business people, as individuals, and as a couple of how they've exceeded all the expectations that they would've had from where they came from to give them an exceptional life that gives them choice and the ability to give back.

  In the way that lights them up. All that's coming up shortly. First, this episode is brought to us by our friends at York Athletics. York is a Boston-based, family-owned performance, footwear brand that believes the fighting spirit inside all of us has the power to redefine individuals, inspire communities, and change the future.

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  Thank you guys so much for coming in today. I

  am honored. I really thought about this and I am so pleased to be in this chair today. I really am. And to give what I can give and do what I can do. So thank you.

  You're welcome. So how about we start by

  both of you introducing yourselves? Absolutely. My name is Marhnelle Hibbard and um, the name Marhnelle is unique.

  It's spelled M-A-R-H-N-E-L-L-E and I don't think I really came into owning it until probably 15 years ago. So, but I love it. It's different and I'm different. So I finally got to own the name. Yes. And what do you do, Marhnelle? You know what, I, I have like a vast amount of things I do. I am a speaker trainer, run a business, created a business, entrepreneurial, wrote a book, two books, actually co-authored.

  And, uh, I am a wife, a mother, a proud grandmother. And, um, I'd say that. I love to cook. I love to cut hair, I love to design, so there's not a whole lot I don't like to do. I, I finally got that life was for getting involved in. So that's what I do get involved.

  Perfect. And we're honored today. Thank you. Thank you.

  Not just have you to have your husband. I am excited. Yeah.

  Welcome

  David. Well, uh, my name is Dave Hibbard. And I'm thrilled to be here as well because I get to focus the light all on Marhnelle, which is what I'm all about. And so I, someone asked me one day, what's my bucket list? And I said, well, my wife Marhnelle is my bucket list because she is truly an amazing woman and I'm proud to be here to offer any support I can.

  Thank you. Thanks a lot for being here. And he drove me here, so that's good too.

  Extra

  support. Yeah, exactly. And,

  and what are you, how would you describe yourself, Dave?

  Well, I'm a, um, a partner first of all to Marhnelle, uh, for 34 years now. So it's been just a miraculous relationship. I'm blessed and I like Marhnelle.

  I'm a speaker and a trainer in the world of sales and leadership and mindset, those kind of things. And, um. I think of, uh, my, my crusade in my life is to move people's lives forward. And so that's, um, that's what I'm up to.

  And that's exactly, I think how I became so inspired by you guys and are so happy to have you in my circle because what your purpose and passion is, is what I think mine is in the sense of pain, empowerment forward.

  Mm.

  How do we help people find the skills that they didn't know they didn't have Right. To get to the next place. Right. Absolutely. And to, and to boost those people up because, um, it breaks my heart when people say I can't, no matter who they are or where they're from, and. I'm glad that there are people like you guys out there changing that for people.

  Excellent.

  Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's because we didn't know we could. And so we have the experience of coming from, we can't, we didn't understand it. Uh, both Dave and I were raised, um, socioeconomically, maybe below standards. I came from a pretty dysfunctional household and so did David. And so getting to where we are now and being able to share that with others, like, wow, I never knew.

  And this to me is really important. I never knew I. Could do something without the credentials of being certified to do whatever. It was like, how do you be an author and not have an undergraduate degree? I never knew I could. Mm-hmm. I, I, and I now have an appreciation for, you don't need credentials, you need a desire, and then you can do it.

  And you need a partner, someone that supports you and just really believes in you when you don't believe in yourself. Mm-hmm.

  Well, but let me give you credit. Having a partner that supports you, because I feel the same about you of course. But before you had a partner, you were already an amazing woman.

  Thank you. And you did things that were extraordinary before you had. Somebody with your back, so to speak. Mm-hmm. Or behind you. Mm-hmm. So how did that happen?

  Uh, total, because that, because I'd like to,

  I'd like to, I'd like to take credit for being your partner to support you, but

  Right.

  But you are a spectacular woman and achiever, so that happened.

  Before me.

  Well, I, I appreciate that. But it was coming from fear, not passion. It was coming from holy moly, how am I gonna make this happen? And as a young girl, I was in sixth grade and my parents were just not engaged and the way that you think parents should be. So I thought, oh, holy moly, I've gotta take over this thing.

  And I did. And when I did, it was more at a survival and fear versus passion and a, a dream or something that I wanted to aspire to. So I remember just absolutely the fear of not having as a single mom enough food or enough. Money to pay the rent or getting the laundry be uh, behind. I thought, oh my God, if that ever happens, my whole world's gonna die.

  And so, I mean, that was the motivation. So it's like the come from isn't as inspiring. It really is draining when you come from, for me it was draining when I came from fear and I have to, and I should, and oh my gosh, versus wow, I get to, and this is where I wanna go with this. And I then it's lighter and it's fun and I love it.

  But

  a lot of women, Marhnelle don't have direction. I mean, there's a lot of men don't have, people don't have direction. Mm-hmm. So I get that you didn't have that direction. I understand your background. So without direction, you said fear, but. But what, was it just organic? It just happened that you suddenly started to get it and move forward?

  Or did, did you have a vision out front or was it strictly motivated by fear? What, what, what? And by the way, and, and if fear was a big motivator, which I hear, when did that kind of let go and vision takeover?

  Right. It, that's a great question. I really thought about it, Kira. Mm-hmm. Coming here and I thought about it.

  I was very young. I was. Just so miserable. I was lonely. I had two children and I didn't even really get the love that I could have. I was really a victim of my circumstances and I was so miserable. So I just woke up one morning. I just thought, I can't stay in this place anymore. The one thing that I realized that I could change is my view of my circumstances, and that was it.

  My pay grade wasn't gonna change. I was still, you know, living from paycheck to paycheck. I was. Overweight, I smoked. I was like, alone. I, you know, and so, but I could look at it differently. I could look at my circumstances differently and start looking at the glass half full versus half empty. You know, I was, well, I, I mean, yeah, I smoked, but I was physically okay.

  So, I mean, there were certain things I could shift the way that I perceived mm-hmm. What I had, and that made a big difference.

  But that sounds so easy. That sounds like you're saying, I mean, if people are listening and they're ladies out there that listen to this and say, oh, well, you know, their life is a struggle, whatever that means, and all I have to do is shift my thinking.

  I mean, how, how do you do that? Okay. I mean, how, how could, what, did you just wake up one day and decide, did you look in the mirror? Did you think about it in your sleep? Did what? How'd that happen? How does that happen?

  Well, for me, honestly, I know exactly when it was, and I really think I hit my bottom. I just couldn't stand the pain I was in anymore.

  Mm-hmm. That was really what it is. So if I could give a tip to someone right now, I would say honestly start a gratitude list. Mm-hmm. Because I really learned that when you start. Thinking about things that you're grateful for. Small things, honestly, it all of a sudden changes the context of your view of life.

  You start recognizing, I mean, it, it's raining today, but how can you appreciate that? Well, you can say, wow, we really need the water in California, so that's a good thing. Versus I just washed my car and it's now gonna get all ruined. Yeah. So that to me, start writing a gratitude list. The other thing that I did was I, I found this little book and it was really about affirmations I needed to.

  Fill my tank. I needed to really fill my soul with some good stuff, and that truly was for me. I just, every day, even though maybe I didn't believe it all the time, or you know, I talk myself out of it, as you mentioned, Kara, I felt like, okay, it just started filling me up in a new way.

  Well, I know it's worked.

  And I'll tell you because, because Marhnelle is annoyingly positive, it drives me crazy. I want her to get negative once in a while so we can have some other kind of dialogue. But this, this woman is just true to positive. She's true to support of humanity. She's true to support of women, to everybody, and it's just who you are.

  A matter of fact, you wrote a white paper and the title, if I recall Marhnelle, was when I get Clear. It happens. Mm-hmm. Do you recall that? That's right. Of course, when I get clear, it happens. What does that mean?

  Well, so we're gonna fast forward for a minute. So what I felt like I really needed mm-hmm. Was some good fuel for my soul.

  Yep. And what that meant to me was I didn't know where to go. I didn't grow up having that necessarily. And so I was living off survival. And so when I started th my soul, so to speak, my psyche, my mind with positive affirmations and started writing gratitude lists and started looking at things like, wow, it started building my confidence to your point.

  Then fast forward, I was still not there yet. And what happened to me was, what I realized was I got a message when I was very young that if I'm married successfully, that my life was gonna be good. Why marry someone who is successful and you're gonna be good. You're gonna be okay. It couldn't come from yourself.

  Yes. Mm-hmm. So I was into my third marriage, Dave, and my third marriage was starting to fall apart. And you're gonna remember this, it was so not,

  uh, but it wasn't my fault. I wanna make that clear. Yes.

  No. But what I learned from is I was still looking outside mm-hmm. For it to happen. So I, I started feeling better, but I still wasn't about me owning, being responsible, understanding that I really can be gracious.

  And you know what? I've gotta step back for a minute. Because what I was, I was honestly manipulative because I was a people pleaser. Mm-hmm. I thought if I make you happy. Then it will work and then you'll get happy. Yes. And that, that was just not right. It didn't, in fact, I lost myself there. Mm-hmm. I didn't, I didn't explain who I was or how I was, and I didn't know how to do that in a kind, generous way.

  Well, I, I hear that like from you not knowing that you could have any power, that you never like, claimed your power. Right. Like you kept giving it to other people to like, you can have the power 'cause I can't be the one that generates and causes things, but I'll certainly support you so that I can come along for the ride.

  Yes.

  And if I make you happy, like you mm-hmm. Please you.

  Mm-hmm.

  I then. It'll work.

  Yeah.

  Not true.

  So, 'cause um, you went from being a single mother of two kids mm-hmm. And figuring this out on your own the hard way. Mm-hmm. And like taking the baby steps of being thankful of saying positive affirmations to yourself, going through that path.

  Right. How did you go from there to meeting Dave? Because, and again, I know you guys as now I don't know how you or when you met each other, right. But it occurs to me that the two of you to get must have always been, um, you know, you're both passionate people. You both have fires in you, which I imagine we're always there to some degree.

  Right. So how did you go from being like, the vision I have is like a small meek like, uh, hunkered down for survival person to being someone that would entertain dating someone like Dave, and then also for the two of you to come together as, as powerhouses as I see you now. Right. So that's a great

  distinction.

  I. Always probably seemed like a powerful person to the outside world. It was the inside conversation that completely kept me, um, feeling that I needed someone else to hook my star to of sorts. Mm-hmm. You know, I needed an engine. I could not be that person. I didn't have confidence in that. And my self conversation was not powerful at all, but I seemed powerful.

  I looked powerful. People would think, oh, she's got it together. And that honestly played into me having to pretend for so long that I was okay. Mm-hmm. Because I really wasn't. Mm-hmm. In fact, it was like, um, the Wizard of Oz. When you see the Wizard of Oz, this big vol, beloved, I mean, voice comes out and yet it's this little guy behind a curtain.

  Yeah, I was like that. I was really that not powerful. And, and then because people thought I was, then I had this persona, which even made me feel worse because it was so fake. Yeah. It wasn't authentic.

  And did people think that you were powerful based on how you were carrying yourself because of what you're doing in your career?

  Probably how I carried myself. Mm-hmm. And um, that I looked and I walked and I had the handshake and I would just walk right into it and say, Hey. But again, that. I learned that from, you had to do that in sixth grade. I had to take over the family. So, you know, I didn't have anything, so I just had to pretend I was that person and that was it.

  And that was, so, I think in a lot of ways destructive, because I didn't want anyone to really know who I was. Mm-hmm. I didn't want anyone to know how fragile I was inside. Mm-hmm. And how I wasn't what people thought I was. Mm-hmm. That was, I was a hard one, a real hard one for me. So when Dave and I met, he thought I was this, but I, Dave and I really grew together.

  We were both coming from our own stories and. It was, he chose me because I was a people pleaser and I chose him because he was strong. But it was really dysfunctional. It was really dysfunctional. And, and we had one incident where my son and he clashed and it was like the whole house of cards just went down the drain.

  Mm-hmm. And, um, I thought I've gotta re uh, it's like taking and. Un it's like a, I don't know. It's, it just, I had to relearn. I had to start all over,

  unwind the, the act and the persona to get to what was really there. Yes. That's, that's great. That's

  exactly what it was. So I started to go to, um, adult children of alcoholics because what I realized is I never had a childhood.

  So that taught me some things. I started going to counseling. I started reading. I, I just, I had to unwind who I thought I was and unwind who others thought I was, and then I had to start ex exposing my real power. But in that, it was like Dave didn't like it at first. Because he, he chose me because I was like, oh, you're so wonderful.

  And now I'm saying I did like that part. Yes.

  And then I was saying that was a good times.

  But, but then I was, but Dave, what about this? Like, who, who is this person? So then we both started doing work. Work meaning, um, self fulfillment. Yeah. Yes. Mm-hmm. And it was, wow. Wow. It was, um, very powerful because. He allowed me space to develop.

  And I mean that because, you know, I, my track record of divorces was pretty high, and he hung in the pocket with me and I hung in the pocket with him. And, you know, people say today, because we, we worked together, we lived together, we've raised, you know, step kids. We have four kids and six grandkids. And how does this all work?

  We've built four houses and, and um, you know, we work on it and we have fun doing it too. It's good. Yeah. Yeah.

  When, when you guys, um, got to the point where you started having breakdowns in your relationship, had you already created your businesses together or was that before all of that?

  Hmm. When was, we had already created our business together.

  Yeah. We, we went into business almost as soon as we got married.

  But where I have a question. Mm-hmm. It's really interesting for me to listen to this because obviously I, I guess I know it, but hearing it again and seeing your emotion and you know, your feelings and all, when did, when did our relationship for people out there who are in relationships that might be struggling, when did it turn?

  Because it, you know, I, I saw your greatness. I, I knew you were amazing and. Somehow things turned. Where did that, where was that? Do you know?

  I do. And you'll know it too. Mm. We were in, um, a transformational workshop. Ah, and, uh, I had asked Dave to go with me and he begrudgingly. So we had this deal that if I really said something was important to me, he would do it for me.

  So I said, this is important. Let's do this. And he went, and you can,

  well, it was, Marhnelle had this, we agreed, well, I agreed that if she ever said, this is really important to me, that I would. Uh, compli to that. Mm-hmm. And, and, uh, and she's only said it in our 34 years of marriage, I think twice. That was one time in the beginning.

  Oh my God. I didn't wanna say yes. I mean, it was this place we're going to go where they're going to look inside you and you gotta maybe talk about your daddy and oh my God, I didn't want to do that. But we went and it was truly a breakthrough. And I, I, it's interesting you bring that up because I do recall that that was a big opening for me to find me and you to find you.

  And because of it, we both found two new people inside each other. Mm-hmm. So as a man, um, it took for me as a man, not that a woman would be the same, but it took risks to be vulnerable. Mm-hmm. And, um. That, I guess you're right about that. I think that's interesting.

  Well, and the key, and I thought you were gonna really share it, is that during the first two hours before the break, uh, you can say you left.

  Well, that's the trainee.

  Oh yeah. But I,

  but the reason that I say that is I would normally leave, I absolutely would normally leave because I need to take care of him. Mm-hmm. You know, he's i'll, I'll figure it out. I need to handle it because I was in sixth grade again. Yeah. You're still trying to control your space.

  Yeah.

  And when I didn't leave. But this is huge. I didn't make him wrong that he went back on a promise I didn't mm-hmm. Become the victim to that.

  Mm-hmm.

  I figured it was his thing to deal with and that I stayed for a week and Dave would call me every day and say, let me tell you what they're gonna do, and blah, blah, blah.

  And I'm, and he was reading all of this propaganda on the internet saying, this is terrible. You're gonna come back, you know, with You're joining Nicole. Yeah, exactly. And I said, thank you. I love you. Have a great day. And I didn't, I didn't buy into my old ways. That was, for me, that

  was big. The more you think about, oh my gosh, I think back on that, that's probably it, because I learned that I was a runner.

  So if there was conflict in our relationship, I would run away. I didn't do anything wrong, so to speak, but I would go to a movie or I'll, I'll make you suffer and I'll run away and I don't need this. And I had that. Space, you know, of, of, of an attitude of that. And so when we were in the training, and I had a big dispute with the instructor, and Marhnelle was sitting down and I was standing.

  Mm-hmm. 'cause they asked me to stand and there were probably 150 people in there. And I thought she would stand up next to me and say, well, I agree with my husband and, you know, blah, blah, blah. But she didn't. And I thought, well, why aren't you sitting in the fight with me? So then that's why I left. I thought, well, I'm not saying that you don't, you don't care for me, that I'm outta here.

  And, and she stayed. That was super courageous of her to take that step and it, it was a big, big and ultimately a month later. Mm-hmm. I said I have to go back because I'm, I'm not being authentic as a trainer and speaker to people saying, you need to change, you need to wake up. But I wasn't waking up, so I went back.

  But that was a big, that was a big one. Yeah,

  that was huge. I mean, for a lot of reasons. Me being courageous and authentic, I'd say if I were gonna give, I talked to my daughter who's very amazing and she said, you know, give a few tips. So the first tip is like, feed yourself some positive things, whether it's affirmations, gratitudes, and whatnot.

  But the other is, I think when you feel fearful about doing something that's legal, I mean, that. Being courageous has supported my life. And I usually start it with, I need to tell on myself because I need to share something that is not comfortable for me either. But when I do that and I come from an authentic space, that it's real.

  I mean, not being judgmental and so on, but it is my interpretation. I have grown so much by that. And in that, do you remember when I said people had this image of me as being so powerful? I was speaking to over 200 people in Australia. They had flown me first class, blah, blah, blah and so on. And I remember saying, and this was my big hidden secret.

  I had never gone to college. I had also been married three times.

  And so to give context to that, maybe let's tell like what the business was. So it shows why that might be. Um. A concern of yours as the leader.

  Certainly that's, that's great. So here I am, a speaker and a trainer. We were hired by DuPont to train leaders who own their own company and they were making Cazillion dollars really highly successful.

  And here I am at the front of the room, kind of instructing them on how to be. And I am thinking, oh my God, if they only knew I didn't have the credentials, I didn't have that degree. I didn't have a master's. I'd gone to Harvard. I hadn't even gone to a state school. I remember at one training at DuPont I thought, God, if I could only be 40, then I would be okay.

  Because you'd have your life experience with you. Yes. Then I could at least that, right? Yeah. At least that. But that is the context. 'cause I felt like a phony. I felt like, why would they listen to me so fast forward when I'm in this auditorium in Australia that I remember, it's almost like slow motion. As I said to them the first time, I'd publicly given my, you know, given up this image.

  That I had been married three times and that I didn't have an undergraduate degree. I remember like my eyes closing slowly and starting to open, and my biggest fear was they were gonna leave. They were gonna look at me and say, why would I listen to you? Why would I ever mm-hmm spend my time? Because you aren't credentialed.

  Who are you? And what happened was just the opposite. What happened was they came up afterwards and they said, thank you, thank you for kind of allowing me to be imperfect. And that is my, I think my biggest joy is that my imperfections people embrace, and I know they'll embrace anyone's imperfection. I really do.

  And I think that's what makes us so lovely, honestly, is well,

  I don't think you can be powerful if you don't have the imperfections. Like there's a, the, the beauty and the humanity allows you to claim being a powerful person, right? Powerful lady, powerful man, whatever. Right? And it's broken my heart when I've asked some women that I know are powerful to be on the show and they say they can't.

  And I totally respect that. Like, you're busy, you have things going on, or they're, they, but most of the time it's that they're at a moment in their life where they don't feel powerful because they haven't achieved what's on their to-do list. And I was like, guys, like you've already done so much, right?

  That so many other people haven't. And I, I, when I was going down the journey of, of transforming powerful ladies to what it's becoming, it's always hard to know where to start. And we don't give ourselves enough credit for what we know how to do because it's just ordinary to us now. Like we just do it without thinking.

  Mm-hmm.

  And

  the, this blogger said, start with what seems so obvious because it's not obvious to someone else. And don't worry about feeling condescending and that you're going too, uh, low on the information scale because there's no such thing. There's someone who doesn't know what the first step looks like, which is why I'm really glad that, you know, debut, encourage her to share like exactly what those steps were.

  Because there's a lot of fluff out there right now about, you know, have gratitude and find your purpose and, you know, change your life. And you're like, cool. Like, how do I even do that? Hmm. Like, most people do not have the structure to even figure out what is step one.

  Mm-hmm.

  And the people that do are like, cool, I got one.

  But there's like 20 more steps and I keep having problems and sure, my career might be taking off, but I'm not going to the gym. I'm not eating healthy. I am in a fight with my mother. Like, there's never being powerful is, is the state of continuing to move forward even when you don't want to. Right. Or it's not easy.

  It's not the state of being complete and perfect. Like Right. You like. You'd have to die to be a powerful person then. And that's not the game we're playing. No, no, no, no. By

  the way, that, that, I'd like to request that we avoid the emotional stories. 'cause I don't know if anyone could see a man, can they tell if you're crying on radio?

  Oh my god. This, this, just watching you go through this, like, it's like a film I remember and emotion connected to it. But I, I wanna bring you back because of what Kara just said. You what I'm hearing. One of the things that has made a difference for you are, are affirmations. Mm-hmm. And, and being courageous.

  Mm-hmm. The courage to, to just whatever that comes from. Mm-hmm. But I wanna go back to this question I asked you about, you, you wrote the white paper. When I get clear, it happens. Can you explain what that means?

  Well, and again, not to simplify it, but I think we all have that capability. I don't know that we've.

  Tapped into it always. Which, which capability is that? When we get clear how we can create things to happen. What does getting clear mean? It means that I am crystal clear on what I want to do or, uh, be a declaration or, yeah. If it's what I am, crystal clear. Crystal clear, and that's means that I can see it, I can taste it, I can feel it, I can smell it, whatever it is, whether it's a job or it's a place to live or it.

  It defies what the norm says you have to go through or be to get that to happen. So as an example,

  well, before you go to the example, can I just cut it? Mm-hmm. But what, but how do you do that? I mean, but you say, when I get clear, it just happens. Correct. Right. How does, it just happens? I mean, I mean, you wake up and then all of a sudden it's there.

  What's the magic to that? What's the, what are you doing? Right.

  I think, I think that's a great question. It's that I am so intent, it's like in front of me always without

  knowing how to do it, without

  knowing how, in fact, it defies logic in most cases.

  I totally agree. And, and I think even a step, um, behind that is right, the things that you decide you want, you don't always know that you want them or that it's that one thing.

  It's the things that don't leave you alone. Mm. Like, I'm, I'm a firm believer in what you, um, resist persists. Mm-hmm. And it could be something to leave and stop doing or something to start doing, but it, it nags at you and it keeps poking at you. And like, when you think that you're in a good space and you're calming down, it still keeps coming up.

  So I think there's a big part of, especially in how we're so easily distracted today between what happens on social media and what it's supposed to look like and what you've been told and what your friends are doing, that when you stop all that noise and come back to like, listening to yourself Right.

  Or God or the universe or whoever. You put that yourself.

  Yeah.

  Yeah. Like giving, giving the voice in your, in your head and heart credibility. You start to put some of those parts together.

  Hmm.

  So you're

  making, I mean, this brings up for me. So I think the clarity is that there's stuff in my life that I needed to handle to get rid of the distractions or, you know, the negative feelings, even though I was trying really hard, I pray.

  So it's like, you know, God forgive me and all. It's like, I'd have people's names I would forgive, and I think I needed to clean that up. Mm-hmm. And so when I did clean that up, so it, it wasn't easy. Again, it needed my courage and authenticity to be able to do that. And, and

  I think too, to go back to going deeper on the clean stuff up, right?

  Like, you, you probably started with a list of things that weren't working right. Or we're holding you back, like, right. This is, it's like the, the things that we don't give up in life and keep dragging into the next future. Right. I'm guessing you probably made a list of like, I'm, I'm, you know, not forgiving this person for this and maybe my car is not clean and I keep forgetting to pay this bill or get it organized.

  Like just things that you don't realize are taking up your mental space to allow you to get clear. That's a good point.

  That's right. Yeah.

  It,

  it truly is. It's almost like an emotional drain, if you will. And mine were more people, 'cause I'm very organized and stuff. Mm-hmm. But mine were more people that I was upset about, angry about, had hostility about.

  And the, one of the ones really was, um, my first husband's wife and how I felt like blah, blah, blah, and dah, dah, dah. And we always had this. Edge to us. And I woke up one morning and I, I could, again, I don't, I must like, not like internal pain because I thought, Ugh. So I re, I switched the way I looked at it and I called her on Mother's Day and said, thank you authentically thank you for what?

  For being the stepmother to my children. And I started realizing that she didn't have it easy either, and started looking at it from her perspective. And here I am driving a Mercedes and I'm in commercial real estate and I'm always looking good. And she's got, you know, basically she was raising my. Two children along with hers and Wow.

  You know? Wow. And it was a complete shift for me to have gratitude about her. Mm-hmm. And I mean, this last Christmas, we all spent together. That was, I mean, that's pretty huge. So for me it is getting rid of anything that's dragging my energy towards what I want. Mm-hmm.

  Or away

  from what you want. Yes.

  Mm-hmm. Exactly. Mm-hmm. And so for, for me, it was cleaning that up, picking up the phone, having a conversation with my mom and saying, mom, 'cause my mom always bragged about me, but she never told me and I wanted to hear it from her. So I picked up the phone and said, listen, I'm gonna call you and this is what I want you to say.

  And I talked to her and I said, mom, she did. I want you to say, wow, that's amazing. I think you're amazing. I'm. Oh, like, wow, wow. And I, and then I, so I said, so I'm gonna call you back and tell you something and that's what I want you to do. And she said, okay. And so I called her and I said, okay, mom, I just did this, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

  And she said. Nothing. And I said, mom, it's say it. Say it. She said, oh, well honey, that's amazing. That is really amazing. I said, thanks, mom and I hung up.

  No, but I think that's a secret that a lot of people don't do is like when you want something specific from somebody, especially in a relationship. Yeah.

  Right. Just say it like it. It's, at first you think it's inauthentic because you're making someone do something, but often it just opens the door where it be they start doing it too. Like, it's

  a great point, Kara, I think you're, yeah, I like that you just said that you think it's manipulative, but it's really deepening the relationship.

  Yeah's great. No, it, it was great because you don't know, somebody

  doesn't know you want something Right. Exactly the way you want it. They're never gonna know. Right. And if they happen to stumble upon it, like that's a small miracle. But like why? Why be mad at them for not doing what you want them to do if they don't know.

  So at least if you tell them crystal clear and in your point make them do it, you are like, all right, step one's done. Now it's in your court. I love it. No,

  that was, that was freedom for me. So getting clear is that I've eliminated a lot of distractions in my life. So whether it's cleaning, organizing, whatever it is, and then, you know what I think it really is, is having the courage to want it.

  Even though maybe it doesn't work out, maybe mathematics or maybe, maybe in your case

  to believe that you deserve it,

  that that would be great. Right? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

  Because I'm listening to you and Kara, and I think what Kara said in is coming out here from my learning of this moment in time, is that clear the deck first, let's get forgiveness.

  And you don't always have to go see a person to forgive them. You can do it in your mind. And but, but letting go of things that are in, in the way, as Kara said, and then declaring your vision, having the courage to declare something correct that you, you said yes. And let, as we say, let the universe bring it forth, whatever that means.

  Right. And that's how you've done things, isn't it?

  It is. It is. And I would say. It defies logic. It defies logic. So I really want you to hold onto that because it is not like, it makes sense because people, I think go, like you said, 1, 2, 3, 4. It does not make sense. It doesn't make sense that I am a paid speaker, you know, and have great, I'll never forget, this was about a year ago that this fellow, I'd never met him, but the COO of a company had met us before and hired me to do some coaching with the president, a huge company.

  So I had never met him, talked to him on the phone a few times, but more distant. Mm-hmm. We rode in this small little sports car for two hours together and he asked me who I was and, and now he had gone to MIT. I mean, the guy was credentialized to the hill. A

  wealthy, successful guy. Yeah. And

  I just said, Nope.

  And I've been married and I got this and I've got pimples. And I'm, you know, that, and I know that by the end of that ride he was, he was touched by being able to be imperfect and to be open to who I really am. And because of that, I had, you know, two years coaching his company and him. And I mean, it was a great, it was really great.

  It really was. But your

  authenticity is opening things up instead of hiding things. That's what seems to work for you. And it's not a strategy, it's just who you are. Correct. It's I'll never, and it's

  a lot less energy. It's keeping this, yes. You had a

  major client and Marhnelle had a cold, she was supposed to go do this.

  Big event for this big company. And I said, don't worry about it. I'll take it for you. I'll do it. And so I called the president and I said, listen, uh, next week, uh, was maybe a few days further down for cold, wasn't gonna go away. And I said, Martinelle's down with a cold, but don't worry about it. I'll, uh, come and handle it for you guys because I am Superman and I can do this.

  And I'll never forget the guy said, oh yeah, well, he said, no, that's okay. We'll wait for Marhnelle. He thought, wait a minute, wait a second here. That's how much achievement she has accomplished. You have accomplished, and, and the great things that you bring forth to corporations who do revere you and listen to you, and you've crossed into a miraculous domain and your talent continues to grow.

  And I admire it. And I, as a matter of fact, Martin, you are my coach. In many cases. I go too because I can get authentic feedback. Mm-hmm. And real feedback, which is disturbing at times, but I go there anyway. And so you're an amazing, amazing woman who continues to move forward and grow. You're still going.

  I thank you. Yeah. And you know, Carrie, you said something earlier that I'm in transition right now and it's scary. I don't like it at all. I, I wrote this maximizing you about when I really stepped into my power. I think I wanted to share that and I wanna recreate that. Mm-hmm. To be able to talk about, you know, to be able to speak for yourself, but not to be, uh, looked at as, you know.

  Being over the top or you know, being called something else, because I've always worked kind of in a man's, mm-hmm. Traditional world and business with commercial real estate and whatnot. But it's that right now I'm in transition and it is scary. Like, who am I gonna next be? And. Um, that's exciting. That's why when you called, I said, okay, I'm totally imperfect.

  Totally dunno what I'm up to and what my vision is. And I believe that it'll, it'll come. I am praying and I am there. And But

  are you clear about it yet?

  Not yet, no. And that's, that's what's happening and, uh, makes it easier if you are clear though.

  Well, when you get clear, I'll be, I know it's fun to show up.

  It does happen. Yeah.

  I know, I know. Yeah. But I, I love the imperfection mm-hmm. Of what's next. And this is what I love, is that there's so much out there. So risk and courage and authenticity are the three words that, and I'd say be gracious because I know for a long time I got married to save myself. I didn't think about anyone else.

  And when I realized that. Maybe I did the same with you, David. You know, I needed that. And then I realized, no, no, no, I need to turn it back around. Like, how can I serve you without losing me? Mm-hmm. Without being a people pleaser, but how can I be a good wife, a good partner, a loving stepmother, a loving mother, and those kinds of things.

  So when you turned it outwards. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. Yeah. It's very powerful. You don't need

  to learn how, because you're doing it. Thank you. And that's the woman you've become. Yeah. I love it. I love it. And that's what

  I think for a lot of, um, like declaring yourself a powerful lady, like the power's already in you.

  Correct.

  So

  it's really just a matter of getting rid of all the distractions and getting clear. Like trying it out. Like a lot of people haven't tried it. It makes me think of the Lion King e uh, scene where, um, Simba roars for the first time, like, until you try, like you don't know how loud you can get.

  Right. And there's so many opportunities to do that in a small way and to build things up. Right? We have an article, um, on the website about like 20 ways to right now for free, like claim some power, and it's simple things like we started, um, when you guys walked in, we were talking about handshakes, but shaking people's hands, looking them in the eye, um, smiling at people being of service.

  Like there's so many little things that putting these micro moments in to start realizing the impact you have on all the people that you interact with. Yes. So I think that so often people associate power with prestige. Mm. And it's really not linked that way at all. It's, it's, the power is in the impact you make for your.

  Community and the people in your life, regardless of how grand it is. Mm-hmm. And so I'm, I'm excited to hear people's reactions and feedback as I start exploring some of those things. Um, to, to go from a woman who felt small mm-hmm. And to go through life and have successes. Mm-hmm. Um, start businesses, you know, get married, um, have success financially, and then really discover your power after that.

  Mm-hmm. Like, you were still being very powerful throughout that whole time. Right. It right. Like when you compared yourself to other women, did you see your, like you as part of a group of successful women, did you see them as separate? Like who were you looking up to and who were you getting inspiration of during that whole journey of finding your own power?

  Hmm. Good question. That's a great question. I'll never forget this. So I didn't have a lot of female friends at all. And I think because I was, again, coming from more scarcity and fear than I was about building my power. And I remember a gal had seen me speak in Chicago and lived in my neighborhood and said, let's go to lunch.

  And I thought, what would we talk about? I've never gone to lunch with anyone because again, it was all about, you know. Mm. Survival. It really was. It wasn't about joy or anything like that. So I don't think that I've had any role models. But what I did do is I did take myself on, so I would go to these classes that I knew I didn't wanna go to.

  So I hated to read out loud 'cause I didn't have confidence in that. And I always had to look the part. I had to have myself. Mm-hmm. My persona, right? Mm-hmm. And this one course I took, I had to comb with no makeup, my hair completely disarray and had to sit in front of this room of people and read, which was so hard.

  But once I did it, I thought, okay, I mean, I didn't die. That was okay. So I internally worked on me. And to be able to break through that self-talk about. Whatever that was. Mm-hmm. I wasn't good enough. I didn't deserve it. I didn't have that, you know, qualification or whatnot and the freedom started just happening and, um, I just, you know, I can't say enough about, you know, being imperfect.

  I love it. 'cause that is who I am. So,

  Marhnelle, I have a question for you. I'm thinking about you when, when you didn't have someone, or if a woman person doesn't have someone. Uh, agreeing with your amazingness, your greatness, whatever, because you're, you're saying that you would, you know, throw your shoulders back and read affirmations and believe in yourself and, but if someone on the other side of your relationship is not supporting that, or they're saying, ah, it's ridiculous, you're this or that.

  Right. How did you, 'cause I know you faced some of that, how did you listen to the positive things in your life, not those who were saying things that weren't supportive to you?

  Yeah, that's, that's really interesting because again, I don't know that women grew up, you know, I know it's a blanket statement, but really supporting other women.

  It was more about if, if I'm number one, then it feels good, and you can be number two, but I. I never had that. I was never jealous of anyone or anything like that. But what I did learn is you do need a cheerleading section. You need people, male, female, children, relatives, whomever to believe in you. You for me.

  So you, you

  would gravitate toward the positive people in your life? I would, I

  absolutely would. I had a good friend who passed away not too long ago, who was amazing and she very successful Virginia. Mm-hmm. And, um, she got cancer and, um, wow. She said I had to take a few people out of my life. I just couldn't do that.

  Mm-hmm. And I thought, wow, that is so. Powerful. It really is perfect because I think the nicer we are to ourselves and to others. I mean, I know that sounds altruistic, but why not? I mean, not why not? Why not? But

  can I ask the two of you, but can a woman do that if she's in a relationship, let's just say with a man?

  Mm-hmm. Let's say it's a man because men can be dominant like this, who's not supporting her. Mm-hmm. How, how does she, how, where does she go? Maybe this, this program is where she goes, but how does she get the confidence to have someone on her side like that when. A spouse or something is not giving her that support.

  It's, what do you two say about that?

  It, it's interesting because we've had a, um, prior guest, super powerful woman who is a survivor of an abusive relationship. Mm. And we talked a lot about how she experienced other women when she was in that relationship, and she was just really isolated. So I think the, there are many people who don't have a cheerleading squad and are actually hearing the opposite feedback, right.

  So I think the first thing that you should do is go find something out in the world that, um, inspires you or you can find new connections with. So that could be like researching books that, uh, are stories you're interested in, listening to different podcasts, following different stories on the digital space, but then also looking for.

  Groups that you can be part of in your community. Mm-hmm. And sometimes it starts by going and volunteering somewhere. Sometimes there's a, you know, random, I don't know, moms who read group happening at the library with their kids. Like, just go and be in community and then like start listening to the people who are having a life like you want.

  Right. Absolutely. Seek people

  who support and are positive and,

  yeah. 'cause I think you almost need, it's not even, I think the first step isn't finding people that are supporters of you, it's finding people who know what that support looks like and support others. Like you have to know what it looks like first to know what you're gonna find.

  Because if you're in a situation that you have, you're not treated correctly in your family and you're not treated correctly from your partner. You don't know what it looks like to be supported, so just go hang out with people who are doing that, even if it's not for you, just for others in general.

  Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And, and a volunteering situation is probably the fastest good place

  to, to go. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Because they're

  definitely outward facing and less selfish. And the people

  who are volunteering are giving, obviously. Right? Mm-hmm.

  And I think the other thing that I've learned is just be in listening.

  For people. And I'll tell you why. Because I think that if you're not used to that, you discount it or you don't even hear it. Mm-hmm. So be listening for someone saying Good job, and accept that and, and say, wow, thank you. Like how I, I mean, I would probably even say, God, I never even thought I could do a good job like that.

  How, how did that show up for you? What? Mm-hmm. And not to milk the, the good job, but to understand what they saw. And I think if you legitimately do that and say, oh gosh, I never thought my, that I could ever do that or whatnot, but being the list. For someone who is there for you that you may discount because your, your own self-talk mm-hmm.

  Is so loud.

  Let it come in.

  Yes. I mean, I think that's a big one.

  Hmm.

  How people discount mm-hmm. Compliments or, or acknowledgements and whatnot. And,

  and you deflect it a lot.

  Yes.

  And, and I think, you know, when be okay with being committed to living your best life. Mm. Like it's okay to want that. It's okay to know that wanting that might cause some disruption in how it is now.

  Right.

  Because

  if you're being uncomfortable is actually going to be great for you. Yes. And I think people get nervous. Like a perfect example in my own life is, for a long time I didn't wanna fight with my partner. Because in, in a too aggressive way, because I thought fighting with somebody would mean that they would leave.

  Mm-hmm. And

  actually like the more, um, bold I am in what I know I need and what I deserve, it's actually working out way better. Because if they leave, you don't want them anyway. Right. And if they don't leave, they're, it's gonna change. Yeah. Right. So I think that there's, um, in my experience and some other women I've talked to, there's this fear that.

  Sticking up for what you know is right or what you deserve is going to shake things up. And that's scary. And it is.

  Hmm.

  I agree. But what's on the other side of that is way cooler than what you're experiencing now.

  Yeah, so great. You know, we wrote, uh, an article, Kara together, it was called The Power of Negative People.

  And one of the things that we've done in our life, in our marriage and our business, and because we meet so many people is if there is any discovery of negativity, even in personal past friendships or racism or things that we get a sense there, we move away from it. We just move. We don't judge it. We don't say, oh, I don't wanna be, you're a jerk.

  We don't battle it. We just move away from it. And so we have managed, as you said, to clear the deck, to have people in our life who are supportive and positive and, and. Stay away from the other. That's what we've decided to do. And it's working in our world, in our, our marriage rather.

  It it is. Yeah. So I have a, um, a a something that I wanna share, and this is gonna be uncomfortable for me, so I wanna demonstrate courage here, is that I believe that it is up to us male, female who to teach people how to be with us.

  And I think when we really take that on, in a bold. Move meaning that not aggressive, you know, but a in an assertive way that this is how I want our relationship to be. Not making them wrong or what we allow them to be in relationship with us in a way that we feel is really healthy and strong and supportive.

  And I think the more I am of that, the more David has grown. And the more he is that of me, the more I've grown. And I mean, years ago I used to just be so sweet, so you know, demure and whatnot, and then I would all of a sudden blow up because I was like a steam kettle. I hadn't just let a little steam out when I felt it.

  I would just go nuts and, but I wasn't being me. So what I think is really important is that we teach people how to be with us. And even to the point, Kara, that you said, if there's no shift for whatever reason, that I don't think it's fair even for them.

  Mm-hmm.

  To, I was in an abusive relationship, my second husband and I allowed it.

  Y you know, Eleanor Roosevelt said, you know, no one, what did she say? Oh, no one, no one could

  make you feel inferior without your permission.

  Yeah. Thank you very much. Mm-hmm.

  Yeah. You know, I have to, I wanna comment here because Marhnelle is this, I love this thing about how, how you teach others to be with you in a positive way.

  Sometimes she would say, I think we should go to therapy. And I'd say, why? Why do you think we should go to therapy? I just think it'd be good for us. Yeah. But we're, we're killing it right now. And we're really good. Yeah. But you never know. We should go. And, and I wouldn't wanna go, but I would go, I, I've come to the point actually as a man where I like therapy.

  But anyway, we'd go, but something would always pop up. There was something in the woodwork that popped out and we think, I didn't even realize that was there. And it kept, it kept the steam, as you said, Marhnelle out of the kettle, so to speak. Right, right. Mm-hmm. Uh, I have to, may I share a story? Sure. Bits of humorous story, which maybe we will serve people who are listening.

  We were sitting on the beach one day with a glass of wine. 'cause we'd taken a wine with us and it was a sunset and we were about to toast. And this'll line up with, with being courageous. And just as we were about to toast, Martinel said, well, wait just a minute. I want to ask you a question. Well, I said, but the sun's kind of moving down.

  No, but just, just, I want to ask this. I said, well, what, what? And she said. And I want you not to answer it until you really think about it. Will you promise? I said, okay. What is it? What is it? Will you promise that you'll think about it? Okay. Yes, I will. She said if there was anything, and we'd been married about how long then?

  It was actually our 10th anniversary. 10th

  anniversary. She said, if there was anything that you would change about me, what would it be? Please think about it. Well, I didn't even realize it was danger. Most men who would listen to this broadcast would say, oh my gosh,

  don't answer. Don't answer.

  But I did. I, I said, okay.

  And I thought, and I put my hand to my chin like I'm doing here. And I thought, and I probably thought for, I don't know, 30, 45 seconds, which is a bit of a time. And then I finally said, okay, I'm ready. What? What is it? And I said, well, you know what? There's nothing. I think you're amazing just as you are. And I love you just like you are.

  And I couldn't be more thrilled with. The marriage we have and the relationship I have. And of course she said, oh, and we clinked and we toasted and cheered to the almost sunset, which was left. And then, uh, right after I thought, well, you know, hmm. Then I said to her, well, let, let me ask you, I mean, is there anything about me that you would change?

  She said, I have five things. I was like, what? How? Five things. I had nothing come on. Anyway, I tell that because in authentic relationship, um, you can have fun with things. Yeah. If we're opening things up. Yeah.

  Well, people put so much significance on asking people questions that they maybe don't want the answer to.

  Don't want the

  answer to.

  Right. And it's like, but once you know, like, there's so much power in the truth because like whatever Marhnelle said were her five things, you could either agree with her. You could disagree with her. You could choose to change or not, but at least you knew where she, she's doing.

  Yeah, but being taller.

  I mean, how do I do that?

  That wasn't it. But he gave me too much time to think he was listening. But this I think is really an important piece that How many times do you, oh, we've been married for 30 years and just got a divorce. I thought, how does that happen? How does that happen?

  And I don't know, maybe it was a huge event or something. But I think you, you mean where someone is married for a long Yeah, a long time. We need to constantly, in any relationship get. To How are we doing? Tune up. Yeah. Yeah. How, how are we doing? Are we on track? Off track? And when I said that you change about me, doesn't mean I change always, but I'm aware of how I'm showing up for you.

  That you think, wow, I didn't realize that. And you, that that knowledge to me, as you said, is really powerful.

  Well, and if you're, if you're committed to learning and evolving yourself mm-hmm. And you surround yourself with people that are in that same space, there's no way you're the same people as yesterday.

  And whether it's a, uh, romantic relationship, if it's siblings, if it's you to your parents, you to your kids, like everyone, if you respect the human experience, you're, you're all changing at the same time. Right? So you have to do these check-ins with really everybody in your life because what was there yesterday may be gone and something new might be there.

  And if you're really living all out. They're, you're going to upset people along the way and giving them the opportunity to say how you upset them. Mm-hmm. Um, that, like, that's a gift to give somebody, like, to let them get it off their chest for you to be open to hearing it and be like, okay. Because most, I don't know anyone that's committed to hurting the people they care about.

  Mm-hmm. And never happens on purpose. I

  love this, Kara. I think that's so terrific because you made me think, because I associated that story with the two of us of course. But you know, we have brothers and sisters and, and children and, and don't ask those things, you know, is it, how can I improve our relationship?

  I just don't even think about it. Mm-hmm. So it's really a good light's on for me right this moment. Yeah,

  absolutely. And, you know, we make, I do, I make up stories about that interaction. Like, why is she so short with me right there? Like, I don't get that. Or Why didn't he call me back? I mean, come on. I'm always there for him.

  And what do I do when I do that? Is that I start getting off track from maybe where we are. Mm-hmm. Versus saying, I God, you know. Whatever. Matt, how come you're not calling me back? I'm talking about your birthday party for God sake. Oh my God, I'm just moving. Or who knows what, but I don't have to make up the story about it, that it's about me.

  Mm-hmm. So it kind of derails or puts grains of sand is how I look at it. Grains of sand can really diminish relationships pretty quickly. Unless you really take that shoe, shake out those sand pebbles and go, mar

  go. Can, can you comment on, on, I just thought of something. You and I are in business together and we've been in everything together.

  We're here together for God's sakes. Um, we've come to the conclusion. That whoever can land the plane best, should land the plane. Can you explain what that means? Because I think it's, it has allowed us to work well together because many people say, how do you, how do you work together? How do you do this and live together and build homes together?

  And, you know, how do you do that? Can you comment on landing the plane? Right.

  That,

  that thought.

  So I think the way that we look at it is that we all, we both have different talents and so what talent is needed for this situation And then the other one takes the co-pilot position. So we're not both finding, because we both are very strong personalities and have bright ideas always.

  So, which one? Really this, this talent is, is Dave's. So then I immediately take second chair as a copilot and he may say, what about this? And I give my feedback, but I let him run with it. And the same with Dave. Mm-hmm Moreell, you're much better like you run with it. So in the houses that we built that I love the conceptual, the design and so on, he's more of the refiner and he'll always find something and say, wow, that's amazing.

  I didn't see that. So I'm more big picture and he's more of the refined detail that is capitalizing on what I think we're best at. Plus what we like. 'cause we gravitate it. Well,

  it's what we always think. Kara, who, who would serve the client best in this particular one? Who has this? Particular talent that would be best for the client, or would it be a woman that we'd better to support the client or the situation or a man?

  And we do discuss it that way, which allows both of us to let our ego get out of the way and do what's right for the, for the circumstance. Mm-hmm.

  Right. Part of how

  we've managed to work well together, I think. Yes.

  What do you do when you disagree about that? Well,

  I, I usually surrender, of course. What? I think that's the number of page one in the book.

  You know what? Honestly, we fight for our positions pretty well, but I think then what we've learned to do is really, listen, it's, for me, I'll say for me, is really admire what Dave's detail. Ads versus like, uh, we don't have but to admire what he brings and listen to it differently and then be in conversation about it.

  Mm-hmm. So that for, and

  for me, and for me honestly, and that's why I'm so happy to just have a little piece of this show with you and sharing with Marhnelle, is I really believe the female brain works differently and a woman brings a different kind of thinking and talent to the table. And so. Um, I've learned working with Marhnelle, who's so talented and bright that I listen because I do think that, uh, there, you know, she comes from a different direction.

  We may end up in the same place, but her path may be better. So I've learned as a man, if any men are listening to this right now, that, you know, if, if, if men can surrender their ego and let the woman's mind in, there's greatness there. And it ha I just believe in that. Yeah.

  And I think that's true for any groups or, or couples because even in a work situation where you all have a table full of talented, amazing people mm-hmm.

  People get so hung up on like, my way, my idea, my credit, and the reason we're all in the room is because together it's going to be better than if we were by ourself. Right. Yeah. And I like, I don't know why that is such common sense and no one's really using it as, as well as they could. Mm-hmm. So a question I have for you Dave, is.

  Obviously you are at a really healthy place as a couple, and you've watched Marhnelle transform

  Mm.

  Prior to knowing her now as this amazing, powerful woman, like, were there other powerful ladies in your life that prepared you for what it would be like to be the partner of a powerful woman? Or that you were inspired by yourself growing up?

  Hmm. Well, the, the first thing that flies by my, my thoughts, uh, my mother was very strong, so I was, I did have a very strong, determined mother. Mm-hmm. So that would probably be it. But, but, um, I don't think anywhere else. Yeah. I, she was a very strong woman, which was interesting because transitioning to a relationship with another strong woman that I had resistance because it was like, look, I've, I've already had enough of, of strength from my mother.

  Now I don't need another mother. So our evolution, um. Uh, along this path has taken place primarily because of that. You brought it up that moment in time where we, we, we, you stood for yourself. You know, that, that, when we were at that program. So, I don't know. You know, I, I, our relationship is born from love.

  I mean, I, she's it for me and I just, I said, she's my bucket list, you know? Yeah. So I think that matters that I really care and I, I have no interest in anything else. Mm-hmm. This is, this is the, the one, and, you know, I, I wanted to, thanks for that question, but I wanted to say, Kara, the other thing that's interesting about listening to women for men to hear this, if a man hears this, is that, I don't know how many times we have been to dinner or to a meeting where the man will look at me, just look at me, or she would ask a question mm-hmm.

  Of the man. And then he'll answer by looking at me and I can look away out of comfort 'cause I feel so uncomfortable. I'll look away to give him, like if he's looking at the side of my head, he'll change direction and look at her. And he doesn't. I look back, he's still looking at me. I'm like, what? Wake up?

  Mm-hmm. You know, there are two people in here and, and everyone matters. So, I don't know. I, I, women have such a value and, uh, I, I guess we as men get to wake up to that, uh, you know, and what could be more rude or disrespectful than to figure that the man has all the power, so I'll just look at you and talk to you.

  Right. It's bothersome to me. I mm-hmm. I've never called anyone out on it, but anyway, I dunno, I brought that up because we're talking about the power of women, so

  Well, and I think so, and I think it's just generically speaking, people put labels on, maybe it's youth, maybe it's someone that's, you know, a senior.

  Maybe it's someone ethically different and. I, I think it's small minded that people do do this and your point, we went out to dinner not five days ago. We're a very powerful man, very successful. We sat at the table and he looked probably 80% at David, and I know it was uncomfortable for Dave, but it, it didn't bother me.

  I just thought, really this is,

  that's just the craziest thing. Have you experienced it, Kara, ever?

  Oh, yeah. I mean, I think the easiest example that most people have probably experienced is like when you, the bill comes to the table, nine times outta 10, they're gonna give it to Jesse. Mm-hmm. The irony is that nine times out of 10, I'm the one that's gonna like pay for it.

  Hey. Yeah.

  Yeah.

  Just because I'm usually the one carrying the money. Mm-hmm. Uhhuh. And it always makes me laugh 'cause I'm like, okay, there's a part of it that appreciates like the gentlemanliness of like what Sure. They wanna be constructing perhaps. But I don't think they're thinking that most of the time.

  No. They're just like, oh, here, give it to the guy. Right. And I don't make it a thing because I have bigger things to worry about. Right. But I do think that it's really interesting to see how it's evolving and obviously you guys have seen women's rights and women's women in the workplace and this whole transition has, it's so different from the different phases in your life to where it is now.

  Right. I mean, what about where we're at today in the women's movement? Like surprises you or, um. Are, are you impressed as as happening? 'cause you maybe never thought it would be at this place. Right.

  So I'm surprised that it hasn't happened sooner. Yeah. And I mean, that really is, so we have a daughter who's an executive with a big movie studio,

  two daughters that are in executive roles.

  Yeah,

  exactly. Well, I was thinking of one, of course, I understand because of the financial implications, right? So replacing a male versus it was like, really this isn't happening? So, and our other daughter who's an executive with, um, a studio is, you know, it's, it's just different roles. Mm-hmm. It's like crazy.

  Like, how is that, and do we allow it? In other words, do we not stand for ourselves? So I'm gonna ask that question and maybe we don't. Um, but if we don't now I. Been independent contractor my whole existence, except once. And so I've always made money that I produced because, you know, I'm a free agent, so to speak, even in our own business.

  So I've been able to not deal with that politics, but I see it and I, I'm really disappointed. I've coached women. In fact, just recently this woman was playing a role of an executive, but she didn't have the title. Well, we don't wanna offend other people. I'm thinking, no, no, no, no. So we got her. To step into the role.

  And now what about the pay? Well, they're really nice to me. No, no, no, no. And so what is it in our heads, if it's a female thing that we go, oh, well we don't need it. It's okay. I can see me doing that if I work for a company. Like, oh no, we'll give it to Dave 'cause he needs it. You know, he's got a family to feed as if I don't, you know, a crazy, or

  or does it even matter?

  Does it even matter who has to feed the family rather than the basis of talent? That's

  what I'm saying.

  Yeah. You know, and I don't know if men listen to this. I assume they listen to this station. Uh, I hope so. To your broadcast Hope, but, but I, I don't know what a man would think about hearing me, but I can tell you that, you know, I'm a street guy.

  I, I am, I'm, I came up through the rough side, the south side of Chicago, and there, there's no, whatever wuss means in me. Mm-hmm. And it is just strictly a level of respecting, um. Uh, another gender. Mm-hmm. I guess you'd say it or whatever it would be another human. Another human. Yeah. It's that easy thing.

  And seeking the talent that they bring to the table. Yes, yes. So I'm not, um, uh, this is not about, you have to, you know, give the girls a chance. This is about the end result of what makes life great. Yeah. And companies to flourish and Yeah. I think to, women need to wake up and men need to wake up. We both do.

  Women need to wake up and be treated the way they want to be treated. And not acquiesce, as you were just saying, Marhnelle. Right. And men get to wake up that there's talent on the other side of the table here that they can, you know, bring forth.

  I mean, there's part of me, and I think this is, is predominant in my generation and, and younger of almost getting insulted when there, if there's favoritism now for being female.

  It's like we just want it to be equal. Like, we're not trying to tip the scales or everything goes this way. It's like, no, like. It's about equality. Like just like treat us the same.

  Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

  And I had a situation at one of my, um, a company I worked for ages ago where I kept getting asked to, to work late on projects because they knew I was, um, not married and didn't have kids.

  And they're like, well, they have to go home 'cause they have their kids or they have to go, like they would all these reasons for like, because they had a family. And I said no. And they're like, what do you mean no? I'm like, I'm gonna help out this one time because we're in a bind and I'm gonna help 'cause that's what I do.

  Good.

  But. I'm not gonna keep doing this because if I keep doing this, I'll never have the family because I won't be doing anything else but working. Mm-hmm. And it was just, and they, it got, it caught them off guard because I know that they were coming from a place of trying to make it all work for everybody that was on the team.

  And it just didn't, those women couldn't stay. They had to pick up their kids. They had like, there's daycare limitations. I got it. Right. Right. But I'm like, we have to find a solution that doesn't make anyone have to do that and like, get it done during the workday. Like there's, this system is broken. And it wasn't even like me versus guys getting to leave.

  Right, right. It was like in just in the female group we had, 'cause it happened to be a, a women's team doing apparel that there was even these silly rules about like, who, who needs to stay and who can go home. Right. And I'm like, mm, no.

  Mm-hmm. Good

  for you. Well good. So

  you, you exercise courage.

  Yeah. I, I also, I mean, good

  for you.

  Yes. I think I was born with a little bit of gumption that just came out. Spot, spot, yeah. Yeah. There's always been an element of moxie. Yes.

  No, I think, you know what, and so I believe that, um, you, you said this earlier, that women feel like we don't wanna tip the scales, we just want equality. And I do think that it is up to us as individuals that I like the movement.

  Mm-hmm. It is great, the awareness, but I think it's up to us to step up to the plate and have it really work out like that.

  Y and i, I don't, it's not even about the female, um, story. It's anyone out there. If you wanna have a great life, thank you. You have to create it yourself. Like no one's gonna give it to you.

  There's so many amazing people that are going to give you a hand. Up or, and to help and to be supportive, like I would not be anywhere without the people who are saying yes to being on the show. The people who've helped me up before. Everyone I call for advice, like no one's in islands in. Yeah. In creating the world that they want for themselves.

  Right. But no one else cares enough about your life to do anything about it most of the time. Absolutely. It's up to us. Yeah.

  I'll tell you, and one of the things from a man's point of view, because I'm in business and I see it and I'm around it, is that I see, uh, many young women, particularly 'cause some of the industries we go into who will acquiesce and they'll hang out with the boys, and the boys are thrown off f-bomb jokes and they, they just let it go.

  Or they'll make remarks and they just let it slide by. And, because the perception seems to be that if, if I, if I do that, I'll be accepted with the guys. Oh, fit. Yeah. Rather than, because I can tell you as a man myself, what I, what I look for, it doesn't matter what gender, it's talent and in competency. And if woman is.

  Is competent. Uh, that's important. If a man is competent, that's important. So, so women, I'm, I wanna say, you know, Marhnelle, you didn't sell out in that category. Mm-hmm. And how do women keep from selling out? Because men, men, I'm a man, you know, some of us are dumb as a rock. We don't just wake up to it. But how do women.

  Stop selling out.

  Okay. I love that question. Yeah, because I even remember in high school, for heaven's sakes, that, you know, I wanted to be liked, I wanted to be popular, I wanted to fit in, and that I would have to monitor like, uh, and walk away. Absolutely. And when I started working with you in commercial real estate, that you protected me because there was what I thought, oh, they're being nice.

  They wanna include me. Well, though they probably wanted to date me or something even worse. But

  so, well

  they didn't, in that industry,

  women weren't looked at back then as like, I dunno what you call it, contributors. They were. Mm-hmm. But, but that's, you know, that's made, I'm sorry to interrupt you, but that's made full circle today, that in that industry, women are still hired to be.

  Helpers rather than brokers, so to speak.

  Yeah. And I think, anyway, go ahead. I think, I think it's up to us. Yeah. I think it's up to us as individuals to take a stand, look for coaches, look for mentors. Oh, that look for someone that really believes in the talent. Mm-hmm. And then stand up and, and show up. I mean, absolutely.

  Show up. In fact, there's, uh, an article I'd love to post, it's called Get Shiny.

  Ah, good point.

  And it, it's, it's really about you as an individual showing up as like a rising star when you're new to something. And so therefore people say, wow, I like, I like that attitude. They're here early. Wow. Mm-hmm. Those kinds of things.

  But I do think what's missing. In the world of, of business is that I have seen this over and over again. It really makes me angry where we call it an empty suit. Some guy, he looks good, he's politically correct, he has a nice suit, but he doesn't contribute anything and he, he makes, he still gets distance.

  A lot of money. Yeah. That, that's, I think, like what is wrong with this? Yeah. But that's

  the, that's the fight going on. But I wanna go back to that article Yes. About get shiny care. Mm-hmm. Because, because what we're talking about is people are looking for mentors, they're looking for female mentors. Mm-hmm.

  Male mentors and so on. And we get asked all the time, how do I find a good mentor? And our feedback is, you don't find them. They'll find you. If you're shiny, they'll find you. Right. Male or female, doesn't matter. Uh, show up big. Play big, be smart. You know, do the things that draw attention to the positive and someone who's talented will find you.

  Well, and and I, I a hundred percent agree with like, keep showing up. Yeah. Right. Like they talk about having corporate co collateral, keep learning what you don't know. Right. Keep expanding and I, and being someone who reached a ceiling in an industry where mm-hmm. There I couldn't find a mentor, male, female.

  Mm-hmm. You name it. Mm-hmm. Because I just got to a point where they were either my boss or there was no one else. Mm-hmm. And I, I would advise to, that's when you have to, just like when people say they can't find someone to date, like you have to expand your circles. Right. Like, who, who can you, who haven't you hung out with?

  Who's another friend to call? Who can you ask? And I think one of the secrets to having your best life is recruiting people to play the game for you. Like if you don't tell people what you're up to. No one can help you. Right? So like the second you start telling people what you are creating and how they can help and like, don't be afraid to ask.

  I love it. Like, this is exactly what I'm looking for. Who do you know? Who do

  you know? Yeah. Because

  it might not be today, but you'll get a phone call three months later like, Hey, do you still need this? I found this person and I am feel so lucky with, with the Powerfully podcast that I at first was nervous to send people out a email that has like six steps of things to do and then follow up emails that have 10 other things to do.

  'cause there's a lot of requests, like we're, we're a a new company in, in this phase. There's a lot of things that we need and I don't know, and how do we get it going? And at first I was nervous to put all my requests out and I was like, no. Like I have to take my own advice. Here's everything I need. Which one?

  Which one calls to you or do you feel, um, excited to participate in? And it's been amazing the feedback where either people are answering all of the questions I have of like, this person, this person tried this, do this, or they answer the one or they don't answer any. 'cause some people just never respond to emails and that's okay.

  But until you put out the request, it's, you can't make,

  but guess what you're really saying when you get clear? Yeah. It starts to happen.

  Yes.

  Remember? See,

  I love it. So there's a friend and I love where you're at because you're on the skinny part of the branch and that is meaning it's not as safe. It, you know, like it, it flows in the wind.

  It may not look like you think it looks and it's called taking risks. Mm-hmm. And I would say if I can say anything, that's where it makes the biggest difference in our lives. Take a risk. And I wanna tell you a story, and I would love to have her on for you, is a woman had this great idea, she was working for a huge company.

  Oh

  yeah. And

  she shared the idea with the company and they could have easily implemented it. They didn't do it. So she decided, and she talked to her family about it, sold everything, moved into a tiny apartment, went out under SBA loans and this and that. And she just got a

  and, and that, but let me interrupt.

  And that was in 2013. Thank you. Is when she began, and this, what is this? Eight 19, where were we? 19.

  The beginning of 19.

  Six years later,

  she just sold her company for a hundred million dollars Now. That she's no different than you. Me, you listening? No different. Honestly, she took a risk. Now, could it have blown up in her face?

  Absolutely. But guess what she gets to do? She gets to remember that she tried it. Mm-hmm. Even if it turned into nothing, she tried it. And guess what? Her first partner sh didn't work out. Mm-hmm. So she had to handle that conflict and unravel that. The second thing is, where is she gonna get the technology to do this?

  So she was in a place she had never been before and she just kept reaching out, outreaching out. She was clear though, reaching out. She

  wanted to do it.

  She wanted to do it, and she enrolled her family to do it. And now, I mean, and it's not just the money, it sounds like, wow. You know what she. Fulfilled a dream.

  Mm-hmm. And that's when you said, show up, stand up, take that risk. Go to the skinny edge of that branch and just believe, honestly believe, I always pray, but believe and pray and stand for something that you really want to happen, because that to me is our power. That to me is your personal power. And you're then.

  I think with that, you're, you're better, you and your better wife and mother and sister. Mm-hmm. You know, daughter and community person and contributor. And that's when it gets juicy. That's why I'm here. Well, I'm excited.

  No, for real. Like, fortune favors the brave. Yes. And everybody has an idea for an invention, a project, a business, how to fix something or, and so much of this starts from like, why is it that way?

  Right. And you, you have it and it goes right. And hello, possibility. We always talk about how there's a shelf life for a great idea. Right. And the people who de who decide, you know what I, I'm actually gonna take this one on, right? Because to your point, it might only go five more feet and then realize it's not for you.

  Like there's somebody else who should be taking this right into the next level. But you keep trying them out, like. This is powerful. Ladies has already been a four year project that I've been frustrated with. Was gonna change a name 80 times, like was gonna just stop doing it. Right. But there was something that like, I couldn't, it, it kept having more options show up.

  Mm-hmm. I could see other things. Mm. And finally the piece of the puzzle came together where we could start taking these steps. Right. And. Yeah, like there's, I agree. Taking the risk and just doing it.

  Courageous, authentic, courageous. Yes. So when you wrote that email, Kara, you were saying, I don't have the answers.

  I need someone, I don't know what I'm doing here. And I love that the vulnerability is so important, I think, to be able to be successful, because I don't think any one person has all those answers. And if they do, great. But I think then you enroll others to be part of that community. Part of that. Mm-hmm. I mean, it's an honor.

  I started out saying today it's an honor to be here.

  Thank you.

  Because I know when I didn't have what I have, you know, I have. Lived on the ocean. I've lived in New York City in a pent out. I mean, I've done things that don't look at my bio lake. Oh my gosh, this should have happened to you naturally. No, no, no, no.

  MIT graduate. No this, no that, no. Whatever. And yet, why not? Mm-hmm. So I'm gonna challenge each one of you listening to this podcast. Why not? What are you, what are you holding back on? Mm-hmm. Because I want you to take a baby step and say, wow, okay. I'm holding back on what? Telling someone you're upset with them.

  Get it off your chest, move forward. What am I afraid of that you know, I, you have to read in front of someone with, you know, curlers in your hair or pigtails when you think, oh my God, I look god awful good. Do it. Step into it because that is your breakthrough that allows you to be that magnificent person that God made you and you are magnificent.

  Well, and we need everybody to step up. Absolutely. 'cause there's so many problems in the world that need solving that we have the ability to solve. Yes. And we just need more people realizing I'm the one that can take this on. Like, if everyone's operating, let's assume the average of the world is operating at like a two.

  Okay. If we can get more people to a five, like stuff's gonna change it. It can't stay the way it is now. Right. Right. So, and that's why we have this like full circle empowerment model of, we're gonna share stories of people who we're, have some of these tips and tricks and like can inspire and Right. Get you thinking about things.

  Because you already have the power. Like let's just give you the tools to start massaging it and, and growing it. Good. Because I need you, I need everyone listening to start like making a difference. I agree. And you already are, but let's make it bigger. Like there's, there's, there's a magnitude that we can achieve if everyone's willing to step into the power that they have.

  It is, and I think be open to the different ways it looks because we were, we had an instance where I, this is years ago, but we, um, I heard an. Uh, television was, that was open Mosque Day and I don't have any Muslim friends and didn't really know any Muslim people, so I thought I would like to go, I would like to experience that to see what their thoughts are, what they, you know, what they practice as religious beliefs and whatnot.

  So we did, and it was fascinating to me. It really was. And Dr. Zeki was the speaker there and he talked about the similarities of Christianity and Judaism and whatnot to all of this. And he was actually brought in by Bush after nine 11 and talked about different pieces to it that night for dinner. We had a couple over and what have you been up to?

  And I said, oh my gosh, it was so interesting. And we talked about going to the mosque and I was. Just taken back the couple were so, um, put off by anyone of that culture and religion and I thought, oh my gosh, I don't even know if they knew anyone. It was just probably publicized and stereo, whatever.

  Stereotyping.

  Yes. It, it was pretty shocking because ah, when we went to the mosque, it was very exciting and the press was there and they didn't try to recruit you. They didn't give you materials. No one. Yeah, yeah. But just an experience of learning and learning and I learning. I think that was

  huge. Just understanding

  and, uh.

  In that evening at dinner at our home, that one of the people said, oh, the reason that what they're, what they're trying to do, they, they were trying to be nice to you because ultimately they want to kill you. And we sat thought, that's heartbreaking. Are you kidding me? No, it is. So guess what, that ended that relationship, not that we stand for Muslims or Catholics or Jewish or any particular, it wasn't that.

  It was just that I don't wanna be around that

  You're not gonna stand for not, I don't stand for anything like that. Not stand for it. No.

  So we move away from things that are not. Um, generating forward motion and our good.

  Yeah. And to your point, if we're all operating at two, if we get to a four, I think I would love to say that we all have open minds.

  It doesn't mean that we have to necessarily agree, but do we have to put 'em in a category of wrong because it, you know, it, I think of food 'cause I love to cook and I love to eat. So does it make it wrong that Dave doesn't like garlic? No. It's just a preference. Mm-hmm. Do I make him bad? 'cause he doesn't.

  No, but when we're in Italy, I said Dave, I think Garlic's like, you know, the state flowering or the, you know, the country flower? And he, he said, no, let's try it. I'm in Italy. So love that attitude.

  Love

  that

  attitude.

  Yeah.

  Well, I think as you're going through a journey of, of being curious and learning and, and pushing your, your own boundaries.

  You never know what nugget you get that you're only given to give to somebody else. Mm-hmm. Like I, I really see in that story you shared about having dinner with that couple after you went to the mosque. That Right. Who knows what you opened up for them in their perspective. Right. That wouldn't have ever come up because you got to have, share that with them.

  Yeah.

  Maybe. Mm-hmm. And

  it may not have happened then. It, like, who knows where they're at now. Right. Planted

  seeds. Yeah.

  Right. But there's something about like showing people that there's a different way of approaching a topic or living life, right. That starts to put the good sand in somebody's shoes where suddenly they're like, huh.

  Right. What? Like there's, it's left in there. There's an imprint that got made. Yeah. So often we don't realize what we put out into the world. 'cause again, you don't, you're not thinking about it that way. Right, right, right.

  No. As a matter of fact, a client, we were up in San Francisco after that. He had done some research on us.

  Now we had already been his client. Or we, he was our client, so he had already engaged with us, but he was amazed. He said, what was that all about? And I said, wow. It was really fascinating opening up different channels of thought and openness. Again, you don't have to agree or disagree, you know, it just, I love it.

  I love learning. I love ex being exposed to different things and understand how different, when we were in New York, it was fascinating because most people that came from different countries were so impressed by our country, and I think a lot of people that were born here don't see how amazing it is.

  You know, it's pretty fascinating, you know, as

  listeners listen to you do this. I, I, I just have to say, it's so funny. Marhnelle said to me one day, she said. Alright, listen, this is what I wanna do. I wanna learn to speak, uh, some one of the Chinese languages. I wanna learn, I wanna learn to speak Italian. I wanna go to, uh, Italy, and I want to cook.

  I I want to do this, I want to. She had about 50. She went on and on about all these things and then she said, what about you? What do you want do? I was so exhausted listening. I just thought, I just wanna watch television. I wanna sit down. I'm exhausted. This

  is the same conversation Jessie and I had the whole time.

  So

  she is this freight train to getting, I don't think I'll ever get to relax, even though I do, but, but she's this dynamic woman that stands for everybody and is probably one of the, you know, one of the things that I have to compliment Marhnelle about, and I hope your listeners can buy into this. We have never, I have never gone anywhere with her.

  That when we left, she said something negative about the exper, about the people or about their home or about something. Mm-hmm. Never, ever. I have all kinds of things I could say, but she never does it. She's just a positive ball moving forward. Mm-hmm. And, and the goodness of that has brought goodness into your life because look at what you do in the world.

  Right.

  Right. So it's really remarkable. Right,

  right.

  No, I feel very blessed. She's

  my, she's my heroes. Our hero. What do you say? Heroin?

  Yeah. Heroine.

  Yeah, heroine. That's what you say.

  I mean, we can also just use hero. Hero. She's

  my hero. Yes. That's okay.

  So talking about moving the ball forward Yes. As we're wrapping things up for today.

  Mm-hmm. What are you up to next as a, as a team and individually and, um, where are you headed?

  Good. Excellent. So as I mentioned, we're in transition and it's scary. It really is. So we're thinking about what's next for our business and we're thinking about selling it. And how does that look? And who would be the right person and how do we let go and what do we do to be able to support it but not get in the way of someone new?

  And so we are looking at finding, um, an exit strategy for what's next for us. And we don't know what that looks like. Mm-hmm. So we're not clear yet. So the answers are not coming just yet.

  We're looking for someone that wants to be in the training business, the speaking business where we are. We've had extraordinary life here.

  We call it a life of choice. It's been remarkable. And Marhnelle knows how to build wealth. We've done that through this business. And so here we have it all bundled up, who wants it? Mm-hmm. You know, we we're looking for someone. Absolutely. So that's the next journey. And then we're. What else are we doing?

  Well, and I think what I'm learning about me, that's why I'm so glad that you invited me. I wrote this program called Maximizing You for Women, which

  mm-hmm.

  For women. And it really was my journey. And it was kind of interesting because Dave and I have always been in partnership. So when I decided to do this, I was actually asked by a client to do this, and I thought, I've gotta do it on my own.

  Which was, it felt awkward, it felt like a chef. I had no. Sous chef. I felt like, God. So, but I did, I got into a rhythm and I did, and it came from me and my heart and whatnot. And at the end, uh, we had a deadline to produce the workbooks and the tapes and whatever, the CDs. And, and so I needed someone to listen to the CD and go through the workbook to see if continuity and outfit some lines.

  So I asked Dave to listen to one of the, the segments and, um. He did, and he came out and it was so cute. Dave is so humble, but he's got such a strong ego. He is like the fellow who wanted me to come, not him to come train Uhhuh. He walked down and he looked at me and after he listened to it and said, this is good,

  oh, it was good and it is good,

  but, but I would like to, uh, rerecord it.

  And I really, well, you're talking about what's

  next, and this is one of the things that mm-hmm. I

  would really like to get this out in the world because you said the baby steps, and for me this was mm-hmm. This was really, really important, you know, from a standpoint of the beginning of. Owning your personal, like what makes you unique?

  Mm-hmm. How, how you differentiate that, and not from ego, but from power. Like really getting like, wow, I really have this talent. I really believe in myself in this way. What does that look like? And discovering your dream, you know, how do you do that? Because it's so, it's a big topic and yes, it's

  how, how do you find balance in your life?

  These are all for women. Yes. Not that men wouldn't use it, but,

  and I love this. What's amazing work is that, um. Number five, the blockades. What's holding you back? And for me it was this self-talk. Mm-hmm. It was really this. I couldn't even hear other people maybe think that I had anything to offer. 'cause it was like, ugh.

  It was already, nah, it's probably not right for you. Or you're not good enough for, you didn't do this or you, you didn't come from the right background or again, but you were telling yourself. Yes. And that was so powerful. But this

  Kara, this is Mar's next journey to get the maximizing you work out to women.

  Mm-hmm. Because it's for women to, to, it's what she believes in. And so that's one part of this next journey and the moving our business into someone else's hands, it's whoever. Mm-hmm. That happens to be. Yeah. And I really wanna say, and we might move our real estate to a different loca. We we're definitely gonna move.

  So we were always on the beach in Laguna on the ocean. It was just like, really? This is crazy. But what happened was we let it go. And when we let it go, we moved to New York. It was like, are you, it was, it was just amazing. So what's next? Like, what's the next adventure? Mm-hmm. But I wanna go back to this.

  Oh. 'cause this is a big one for me. Assertive versus what number is this? Progressive number nine.

  And you're, and you're listing off of the 12 steps that you kind have in this program. Yes. But

  I didn't know assertive

  versus aggressive.

  How to be assertive. I could, I could be passive and compliant and people pleasing, or I could be aggressive.

  Mm-hmm. Not so good. So, you know, what's that temperament difference? How does that work? And I also think that men can, can learn from all of this. In other words, this is a practice of, I did it for women, but a practice of just being. Kind of a, a, a good gracious human. When will you roll this out? Human being?

  What's your vision? You said you get clear, it happens. Yeah, I do. Are you clear?

  I'm pretty clear. Pretty clear, but not clear.

  Absolutely.

  Well, I don't have a date yet 'cause I have to talk technically about a few things, but I would guess in the next 90 days for sure. Yeah. Because I do think it, the value is how can I give someone something so they can have the life of choice I've been able to create.

  And

  in my listing, I just heard her say, I guess in the next 90 days, there's no guessing. Okay. When you get clear, this is going to happen. Exactly. Okay. Let's be clear. Well, you can decide later, but I'd say everything is about that. You know, everything in Martinelle's world is, is this powerful woman when she declares it, there's so many instances I could tell you.

  Mm-hmm. But when, because she's done it many, many times, when she declares it, it gets clear. It just happens without knowing how, in the face of no evidence of how to do a thing. Mm-hmm. She accomplishes it by just declaring it. I think Jim Carrey said when he was, I heard this was a story when he was a starving actor, he put $10 million check in his wallet and said, someday I'll be paid that.

  And I'm sure his fellow actors said, oh, good luck. How are you gonna do that? Right? 'cause everybody's in the how question. Mm-hmm. And I know he must have replied, I don't know how, but I know I'm going to. And Marhnelle lives in that domain of declaring something and it just comes about. And so.

  What that,

  when you do that, this is, that's going to happen.

  This is easy. Yeah. I think it's still in my head percolating. What else is there? But I'm thinking for

  women out there wondering Yeah. But how do you do it? Yeah. I don't think it's a how thing. It's a declaration thing. It is

  absolutely.

  Absolutely.

  Okay.

  And there's a lot of hustle and hard work, and there is no doubt there's so much between those things.

  But I know when you're ready for this to come back out. Right. We would love to support you and showcase this and get this out to all the people who are powerful ladies. Perfect. Good. Um, I think it's a great course. I, I've read your, um, book, um, soar Selling, selling Uhhuh, and. It's a great book. It's like, I recommend it to everyone that's in the sales world, because again, you guys give people the zero to four steps.

  Yeah. Right. And then the five to 12 steps, like Right. There's nothing left out about how you start that process. And I'm guarantee that this will also be the same way. Like there's nothing, no, nothing left where you have questions of like, how do I actually do it? Good,

  good,

  good.

  I

  love it. I know there's something big for me.

  I, I really do. And I am scared to say that. But there's, there's so much that, um, you know, I think you and I, and I, I just putting this out there, I think that we can do couple things too. Mm-hmm. Because I really do think a powerful woman can really engage with a powerful man and have it really work perfectly.

  I mm-hmm. I, I know sometimes men have felt like, maybe you're powerful. I'm not sure how, but I think a good, powerful woman allows a man to be really a good, powerful man. So I think it's that good balance. Yeah.

  It's, it, you have to be. Supporting each other to maximize each other's greatness. Yes. Yes.

  Otherwise, no one really gets to be their full greatness. No,

  absolutely. So thanks for asking. And what are you up to? So what's this? Me? Yes.

  Well, there's so much, but um, obviously we're the Powerful Ladies Podcast is coming out. We're gonna be supporting more women, uh, through the store on the website, uh, providing our own tools and courses.

  'cause again, like we want practical tools. We don't wanna be talking about gratitude and manifesting and leaving it in this theoretical space. Right. But giving you the actual like, do these five things and something's going to change. Right. And I'm a big believer in lists and like, just here's a list. Try these different lists and like.

  They're going to work. If, if nothing big moves, your brain's gonna start thinking about the world differently. And that's, I think, probably step one. I love it. Yeah. It, it, it's been such a pleasure to have you guys here. Oh, thank, thank you. I'm honored that you were Yes. I'm so excited I got both of you in the studio.

  I know. Thanks David, for Thank you sharing

  this. You Mar I, I've, I've learned more just again, sitting here listening to, and there's so many reminders for me about, um, what makes things tick for our relationship and, and you and women.

  Yeah. Yeah. Good. Excellent. Thanks. Thank you, Kara. Thank you.

  There are so many amazing nuggets of pure goodness in this episode that it was really hard to pick an opening teaser. Don't you just love them? You can hear their commitment to making a difference, continuing to grow and to be there for each other. I love that they're able to be vulnerable, be authentic about where they come from, what they've been afraid of, what they've overcome, and share the realities of their life both past and future as they're navigating towards an unknown in their next phase of life.

  To support Dave and Marhnelle, you can buy their two books, store Selling and Canoe Theory, both available through powerful ladies.com/tools-read basically in our tools section under books. You can visit their website, dialect.com. Email them info@dialects.com and follow Dialects Inc. On Instagram. As soon as Marhnelle is ready, we will have Maximizing You Available on the powerful ladies.com.

  Sign up our newsletter to be the first to know when it's available and to be able to participate in that program. If you'd like to support the work that we're doing here at Polities, there's a couple of ways you can do that. Subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcast, Stitcher, Google Play, or anywhere you listen to podcasts.

  Leave a review on any of these platforms. Share the show with all the powerful ladies and gentlemen in your life. Join our Patreon account. Check out the website, the powerful ladies.com. To hear more inspiring stories. Get practical tools to be your most powerful. Get 15% off your first order in the Powerful Lady Shop.

  Or donate to the Powerful Ladies one Day of Giving campaign. And of course, follow us on Instagram at Powerful Ladies for show notes and to get the links to the books, podcasts, and people we talk about. Go to the powerful ladies.com. I'd like to thank our producer, composer, and audio engineer Jordan Duffy.

  She's one of the first female audio engineers in the podcasting world, if not the first. And she also happens to be the best. We're very lucky to have her. She's a powerful lady in her own right, in addition to taking over the podcasting world. She's a singer songwriter working on her next album, and she's one of my sisters.

  So it's amazing to be creating this with her, and I'm so thankful that she finds time in her crazy busy schedule to make this happen. It's a testament to her belief in what we're creating through Powerful Ladies, and I'm honored that she shares my vision. Thank you all so much for listening. We'll be back next week with a brand new episode.

  I can't wait for you to hear it Until then, I hope you're taking on being powerful in your life. Go be awesome and up to something you love

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Buy their book Soar Selling. A must have for anyone in the sales world, which let’s be honest is every business!  

Buy their book Canoe Theory.

Contact & email them through their Dialexis contact page.

Created and hosted by Kara Duffy
Audio Engineering & Editing by Jordan Duffy
Production by Amanda Kass
Graphic design by Anna Olinova
Music by Joakim Karud